13TH Hussars side cap badge

[Alan O]

A recent find. These have been faked in huge numbers as die struck badges rather than die cast.

[tonyb]

Very nice thanks for sharing.
Tony.

[magpie]

You may find this also a die struck badge.

[Bill]

Hi Andy

No, I don't think these are side cap badges but the for forage cap, as listed in the 1911 dress regs. The XIII badge is for the FSH. I gave the full entry from the dress regs in the thread two weeks ago (but there were no posts following my questions).

The 13th came directly from India to France, so I wonder if they used the FSH badge in the cap at that time.

The badge below has had the loops replaced by a slider but there was a good FSG XIII badge with a long slider for sale recently on ebay. However, does anyone a silver-gilt XIII badge or has anyone ever seen a genuine XIII brass economy badge?

Cheers

Bill

[2747andy]

Originally Posted by Bill

Hi Andy

has anyone ever seen a genuine XIII brass economy badge?

Cheers

Bill

Bill,
this looks like a good contender?

Andy

[2747andy]

The rear.. (better images TFO)

[Bill]

Thanks Andy, it could well be OK. There is one on ebay that looks awful!
If this was the FSH pattern, why was there an economy issue?
Cheers
Bill

[Bill]

Here are two more badges, bronze 13th H OSD and what was once a gilt badge about 1.5 mm shorter (probably and officer's collar dog?).

The bronze badge is by Gaunt - like you Andy I'm not a fan of Gaunt Great War badges!

Bill

[Alan O]

Neither am I but I like the die struck ones even less. Their number and the style of slider make me suspicious. As the successor 13/18th badges were die cast, it is die cast 13H I was after.

[Alan O]

[QUOTE=Bill;333178]Hi Andy

No, I don't think these are side cap badges but the for forage cap, as listed in the 1911 dress regs. The XIII badge is for the FSH. I gave the full entry from the dress regs in the thread two weeks ago (but there were no posts following my questions).

The 13th came directly from India to France, so I wonder if they used the FSH badge in the cap at that time.

Bill

The following takes you to the '13Hussars in the Great War'

http://www.lightdragoons.org.uk/downloads.html

from the photos at the back:

13Z badge only worn by officers in all hats and as collar.
13 in wreath worn on peaked khaki and peaked No1 dress hats by ORs.
No badges worn on the khaki FSH for normal wear.

If you go to XIII Hussars Vol 2 it has the details of all uniforms. P286 talks about cap badges but again I believe that it refers to Officers only (13Z type) and does not mention ORs. I suspect the 1911 Dress regs refer to Officers as the ORs are to be seen wearing the XIII wreath badge in the linked books.

At the back it shows officers with bi-colour diamond patches on their FSH. I would imagine the ORs would wear the same.

there is one photo with ORs with FSC but the badge cannot be seen.

[Malcolm Davey]

Originally Posted by magpie

You may find this also a die struck badge.

Here are my examples of cap and collars note the cap badge is die struck and so are the collars.
Malc

[lettman]

This example turned up with an OR's medals and other effects. You can see the JR GAUNT LONDON mark under the slider.

[Bill]

In the 1904 dress regulations,
"Badges - Forage Cap, Glengarry and Puggaree. Staff and Cavalry" Plate 28 shows the wreath XIII and Z badges. The Z badge is specifically described as "FORAGE CAP BADGE" which implies the wreath badge is for the puggaree.
The wreath badge also looks to be all brass, not bi-metal - but this could be my imagination!
Does posting this Plate constitute a breach in copyright?
Cheers
Bill

[Bill]

Andy
Thinking about it, might your economy wreath badge with the clipped slider be a puggaree badge of the 1904 period?
Bill

[Lancer 17]

Hello Alan & Bill

My 1900 dress regs have the 13 H badges on plate 49, the X111 badge is described as a puggaree badge and has a"normal" QVC, however the Z badge is described as being for the Field Cap and has the "flat" QVC similar to the QVC 9th Lancers and 21st Lancers badges. The Field cap is shown on plate 9 and is the multi colour "side" cap type.

In the appendix on page 83 the collar for Tunic and Frock it describes the X111 type and under the heading of On Field Cap it states "As for collar".

Now that does confuse things as theres no mention of the z type badge.

I have 2 of the z type of badge, one has a flat back with 2 old D type of lugs, the other is die struck with a slider. Both appear to be quite old.

I hope that this helps.

Regards

Phil.