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#1
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Help identifying this uk badge
Right i have no reason to believe this is a fake. It came home with my grandfather and his few belongings at the end of the 2nd world war. He was stationed in scotland at the end of the 2nd world war (due to the other troop he was in pretty much died so the remaining members were posted into other troops)
I can't find it anywhere on the net, i have tried to search on here but there are so many other badges i just havent found what i was looking for. If you could help identify this i would be very grateful as it would be nice to know. |
#2
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I don't think this is military. It's the motto of the order of the thistle and looks to be a general crest of Scotland in the form of a clan type badge. Regards, Paul.
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#3
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well that's what i thought to begin with when i couldn't find it in military references but i cannot find it in clan references either. So im back to the original story of military. Considering he was stationed up in Scotland towards the end of the war i was wondering if anyone new of any stories about "this will have to do for them" or the like?
The closest i found in the clan badge search was one with a more "flaming mane" and extravagant tail. It was solid and not cut out inbetween and the writing was Nobilis Est Ir Leonis. I have not as of yet found a combination of the rampant lion, the writing and the circled belt. It's always been missing one thing or another. |
#4
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Yes. I too am having a problem finding another clan type badge the same. One on a shield plaque though- http://www.scotsconnection.com/produ...istory=related
What unit was he originaly with? Bound to be someone on here who can give you more information if you can tell us that. Regards, Paul. Last edited by wardog; 11-07-11 at 11:20 PM. |
#5
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I have a similar badge but picked it up along the way.
Scot Clan Badge.jpg I had come to the same conclusion that it was a Scottish national badge; I couldn't find it in the clan badges. Paul, its interesting that on your link its shown with the Royal Stewart tartan. I would also be interested to see if it was ever used in a military context. regards, Iain
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C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas la guerre |
#6
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The lion rampant - like this one - is the heraldic animal on the Scottish flag and a common symbol for all things Scots. "Nemo me impune lacessit" [No one harms my with impunity] is the clan motto of several clans, I believe, so my money too is on non-military.
Peter |
#7
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Both of those pictures are the closest i have ever seen!
My mum seems to think it was the cameronians? but she cannot say that with complete certainty. He had kept another badge with it which is often described as the "bugle" style. It's small, round, and curves out so its not just flat. It seems to be a brass backing with some kind of light marble effect stone/shell layer on top and then the bugle logo with blue scroll type things top and bottom of bugle from what i can recall. The story goes along the lines of he started in the RAF in england as one of the blokes who used to remove the chocks from the wheels of the planes .. which of course everytime this story was told someone cannot resist shouting "CHOCKS AWAY!!" But when his own troop became less and less he was somehow transferred up to scotland to the cameronians (as far as my mum can remember the stories). We have an old book somewhere that was what the soldiers used to carry with them that contained all their training and test dates along with from what i can remember - information on what jabs they were given and at the back it had the "will" section which my grandad never filled in. Also there is a rate of wage list still intact in its back pocket/sleeve. However this book looks like his old RAF book which got a piece of paper stapled over the "raf info" page with some form of "land army" version instead. I know its a badge forum but if you wanna see it let me know and i will scan it and upload it. |
#8
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Your badge is a civilian Scottish clan badge - not military ! As to its specific origins, the point has been made that the two characteristics - the lion rampant and the motto - are Scots in a generalised way. Many Scotsmen have no direct lineage to a clan and such a badge - worn either on a plaid or on a ladies' mantle - would signify a Scot. The badge has no military significance whatsoever and, as such, is certainly not Cameronians (Scottish Rifles). David
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#9
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well fair enough, like i said i would like to know what it is, and if that is the answer then fine. Would love to be able to go back in time and find out how he acquired it. If it was given to him or if he purchased it there during his time training in scotland. Also why he kept it with his other military badge ... it's very annoying when people go and die on you and you can't ask these questions tut tut
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#10
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Soooz,
It sounds like the second badge which you have described might be a Cameronians sweethearts brooch. You also appear to have your grandfathers pay book. If you can put some pictures on the Forum it may be possible to tell you more about your grandfathers service. I can only agree that the badge you posted the picture of is a scottish clan brooch and not military. ( In Fairbairns "Crests of the Families of Great Britain and Ireland " the motto ( which is also the motto of the Order of the Thistle ) is also attributed to the Irwin and Nettles families ) See the bottom crest on the page this link will take you to: http://www.scotsconnection.com/Clan-...ds/c-1-68-244/ ( sorry I did not realise this link was in a previous post ) P.B.
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Interested in all aspects of militaria/military history but especially insignia and history of non regular units with a Liverpool connection Members welcome in my private Facebook group “The Kings Liverpool Regiment ( 1685-1958 )” Last edited by Peter Brydon; 17-07-11 at 11:55 AM. |
#11
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i think the second badge i described is from lancaster or leicester which i believe is where he was prior to scotland, its hard to remember what it said. I am visiting my mother today and will bring both the other badge and the service book home with me to scan. It would be nice to know what some of the abbreviations in the book stand for. From what i can make out he did a lot of rifle training and something along the lines of a "gas drop/chamber"??? test. Which i am guessing would be a "how fast can you get your gas mask on" kind of thing.
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#12
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Ok first of all here is the second badge. My memory of it was slightly wrong. It wasn't lancaster or leicester. The writing says "K.O YORKSHIRE L.I"
Unfortunately had to try and scan it in as it is too small for my phone to pick up. The ends of the horn/bugle thing are the same blue as the scroll banner. If you are interested in the Soldier service book, wages and life insurance then the link is here: http://s756.photobucket.com/albums/x...20Memorabilia/ as there are loads of pages and don't want to flood the post with them all. He was in the cameronians. Found a second ID photo hidden in a back pocket of the book and it has cameronians written on the back with his handwriting. If anyone know where i can get any more information about my grandads time in the army i would be very grateful if you let me know. Thank you for taking the time to look |
#13
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Soooz,
The badge is a sweethearts brooch of the Kings Own Yorkshire Light Infantry. I am sure other members will be able to tell you how to further research your garandfathers war service. P.B.
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Interested in all aspects of militaria/military history but especially insignia and history of non regular units with a Liverpool connection Members welcome in my private Facebook group “The Kings Liverpool Regiment ( 1685-1958 )” |
#14
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fair enough. I wonder if the scottish one was used in the same manner then? As if a way to say "this is where my fella is".
One question that the soldier's book made me think about was can anyone explain the "order of the oddfellows"?? I thought that was a kind of cult for posh gents?? He's down of C of E for religious background but the insurance paper says something along the line of he is a member of the order of oddfellows? |
#15
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