Male Sphinx

[rmarsden]

Large die-struck Sphinx (no boobs) in silver plate 70 x 50mm.
Fittings are 4 silver rings around the periphery.
Probably a band pouch or a sash badge, but which Rgt used a male Sphinx?

[Paul Spellman]

Lincolnshire Regt?
Regards
Paul

[norfolk regt man]

hi, Gordon highlanders, but with an asp on the forehead,gloucestershire have worn both,swb,lancashire fusiliers,

[Hussar100]

I think it's a Black Watch piper's badge.

One of the things to look for is the position of the tail. In this case it rules out the Glosters, Staffs and Lincs.

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by Hussar100

I think it's a Black Watch piper's badge.

One of the things to look for is the position of the tail. In this case it rules out the Glosters, Staffs and Lincs.

The Black Watch seem to have used a female Sphinx. Unfortunately, the gender and style of Sphinxes was not consistently followed by all regiments, although in their defence this was in part because of efforts by financiers to 'standardise' insignia where possible, which forced some units to change the pattern used at various times, sometimes changing gender. The Lincolnshire Regt male Sphinx was unusual in that it always had a distinctive, full length 'mantle', so I am fairly sure it is not from them.

[Hussar100]

Originally Posted by Toby Purcell

The Black Watch seem to have used a female Sphinx. Unfortunately, the gender and style of Sphinxes was not consistently followed by all regiments, although in their defence this was in part because of efforts by financiers to 'standardise' insignia where possible, which forced some units to change the pattern used at various times. The Lincolnshire Regt Sphinx was unusual in that it always had a distinctive, full length 'mantle', so I am fairly sure it is not from them.

This one seems to be male but that's an officers badge.

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by Hussar100

This one seems to be male but that's an officers badge.

It could be, but it's difficult to be sure. Although the teats are not as apparent as some, the chest does protrude a lot if you compare it with the OPs photo and/or the Lincoln's 'male' Sphinx. The various Sphinxes are notoriously difficult because they changed so much.

[Paul Spellman]

The Regiments who took part in evicting Napolean's French Army out of Egypt by 1801 who where awarded the use of the Sphinx (not all used it in their Cap Badge) as a battle honour, did not know at the time wether the Sphinx was male or female as it was still mostly buried in sand at that period before excavation so a bit of squaddie artistic licence was took in adorning it with breasts in their badges etc apart from the Lincolnshire's whom seem to have predominatley preferred the male type throughout their history
Paul

[fougasse1940]

Edwards 'Regimental Badges': As to the type of Sphinx that would be appropriate to commemorate a campaign in Egypt, one would have thought that an Egyptian Sphinx would be used. In this case not so. The distinctive points of an Egyptian Sphinx are that it is exlusively male, has a beard and its tail lies on its back, as opposed to pointing up over its back. The Sphinx of Thotmes III at Cairo is a correct Egyptian type: it had a beard originally but that has been worn away. The Sphinxes flanking Cleopatra's Needle on the Thames Embankment, London, are practically identical with that of Thotmes III, except that they have no beard.
In view of the above, none of the Sphinxes borne on the Colours or the badges of British regiments is correct, for none has a beard, a number are obviously female as shown by their breasts, and have the tail pointing up over the back.

Rgds, Thomas.

[Hussar100]

Originally Posted by fougasse1940

Edwards 'Regimental Badges': As to the type of Sphinx that would be appropriate to commemorate a campaign in Egypt, one would have thought that an Egyptian Sphinx would be used. In this case not so. The distinctive points of an Egyptian Sphinx are that it is exlusively male, has a beard and its tail lies on its back, as opposed to pointing up over its back. The Sphinx of Thotmes III at Cairo is a correct Egyptian type: it had a beard originally but that has been worn away. The Sphinxes flanking Cleopatra's Needle on the Thames Embankment, London, are practically identical with that of Thotmes III, except that they have no beard.
In view of the above, none of the Sphinxes borne on the Colours or the badges of British regiments is correct, for none has a beard, a number are obviously female as shown by their breasts, and have the tail pointing up over the back.

Rgds, Thomas.

I fully agree. Some of the Sphinxes used in British Army badging are of the types known as "French" or "Greek" as well as the more familiar Egyptian.

Could I take issue with you though? The Sphinx as most of us know it is actually female, although it has a beard. The beard was a sign of status in ancient Egypt. Boy and women Pharaohs wore a false one.

[fougasse1940]

No issue with me at all, I just quoted Edwards. Interesting to hear more about sphinxes though. A good reason for more research.

Rgds, Thomas.

[norfolk regt man]

these are well known copies of something.

[norfolk regt man]

more types,

[rmarsden]

Thanks for all the replies guys, I was hoping it was Black Watch but probably wishfull thinking.
My large badge below cast brass silver plated (80% rubbed) is exactly the same size, I believe this to be a Drum Majors sash badge possibly BW? Fittings have been removed from the reverse.
Below that a silver plated die-struck BW DMs bonnet badge from the 1970s, two long screw posts to the reverse.