Military Foot Police WW1

[GriffMJ]

How about this one? It has the same name plate with the same flaw in it (as in the fake) ..... I dont like the look of the crest either?

[John Cameron]

All of the Military Foot Police badges illustrated so far are repros. I've seen at least 5 of these in conditions ranging from well worn and aged to brand new glossy. All bear the same characteristics: tall lettering and flaws between the "Y" and "F" and under the "C". The one illustrated on my website is a repro and identified as such.
Regarding the Military Mounted Police, the pattern of badge we associate with the Corps of Military Police was worn by the MMP starting with the Edward VII version, then went to the G V R version. When the MFP and MMP amalgamated in 1926 to form the CMP, the MMP badge was used. Strictly speaking, if the CMP style badge was produced prior to 1926 it is a proper MMP cap badge. Below are the Edward VII and George V MMP cap badges and two versions of the First War Canadian Military Police cap badge.

[GriffMJ]

Hi John

My point exactly ..... about the repro's. Many thanks for putting your badges up, its good to see the real thing.

The font used on the scroll of your EVIIR badge is that seen on the KK1029 badge. Somebody has gone to great lengths to repro the KK1029 badge (and in turn KK751 - 1RD) and they try and get two badges out of one, but fail to get the "detail" correct.

Here is another type of fake (different type of name plate but still a repro)... so thats 3 and counting.
Repro type 3

Repro type 2

Repro type 1 (left)

[Mike B]

The 'Military Foot Police' early headdress badge KK1029 i.e. Royal Crest and Scroll was all Gilding Metal (No White metal is correctly mentioned in Kipling and King) even though the badge is made in two parts. See also the excellent article "Badges and Buttons of The Military Police" by Lt Col NW Poulsom RMP which appeared in the Bulletin of the Military Historical Society vol XXII May 1972.

[paj1]

Bosleys have a "mounted military police" cap badge on the front of their
postal badge auction catalogue. price guide £300 - £500
paj1

[GriffMJ]

Hi Mike

Here is the real one against the "Best Fake?" I have found. What you will find is that the real one has the same crest as the 1RD of the same period "Weak Tailed"..... with the seperate gilding metal name plate (identicle to the 1RD name plate but gilding metal and "MILITARY FOOT POLICE" in the same font as seen on the later police badges). NB: The badge is most likley to be found with three loops N/E/W only?

[faubourg]

Does this article help in any way

http://www.rmpa-cheshireandnorthwale...badges_54.html

The examples shown everywhere I look show the same flaws in the same places on the scroll, regardless of the cypher. If the badge really was not officially issued, that should rule it out for serious discussion I think

[Praepositus]

My research over very many years has led me to conclude that the much reproduced bi-metal MFP badge was never issued and was never adopted for wear. Indeed there is no photographic record of the bi-metal badge ever being worn - while there is photographic evidence of the MMP and MFP shoulder titles being worn on the Coloured Field Service Cap until 1901, and on the Broderick Cap thereafter before the KC EVIIR capbadge was in use in about 1903/04 - nor have I found any sealed pattern or other record or related order. The MMP bi-metal version (exactly the same as the MFP version, but with a 'Military Mounted Police' scroll) mentioned above, sold at Bosley's in January this year for £770.00 and I challenged its authenticity at the time, but Mr Bosley stood by the badge and its "unimpeachable" , but undisclosed origins.

As has already been mentioned on this thread, there is an all gilding-metal MFP badge - the so-called 'Shorncliffe' badge - at the RMP Museum (which features in Kipling and King as KK1029) - as it was allegedly adopted for wear locally by the handful of MFP NCOs stationed at Shorncliffe in Kent, but recently, doubts as to this badge's antecedence and origins have been voiced.

If one just looks at the sheer number of MFP bi-metal badges in circulation - far more than the very, very small numbers of MFP that were actually serving between 1901 (and the death of Queen Victoria) and the issue of the KC EVII cap badge (KK 1030) in about 1903/04. Even at the outbreak of the First World War, the total strength of the MMP and MFP numbered no more than 3 officers (the Provost Marshal and Commandant; and Assistant PMs at the Curragh and Tidworth) and 508 Warrant Officers, NCOs and men.

I know one should never say never in the military badge collecting world, but I am 99.9% certain that the bi-metal MFP (and the only MMP version I have seen in Bosley's catalogue) badges are not kosher. I believe that the transition from the Home Service Helmet Plate to KK 1030 occured without KK 1029 being issued in any great number if at all, and that the bi-metal version was never issued and that it is a rogue badge.

[Alan O]

While I hold the auction house in high regard I agree that no one is infallible and I have disagreed with their views on items in the past (a spurious economy Notts and Derby badge for starters).

[GriffMJ]

Nudge .... for Simon.

[LONGSHANKS]

Yeah, read this through. It made me feel I'll never get a good one as regards the loops.
Also reading that K&K said all GM, I picked up the one I got as the best I'll get. It's good enough for me, knowing that being stuck over here in the States; the chances of seeing a good one is slim.

Thanks again

[GriffMJ]

I am still looking Simon ...... I have not seen "one" as shown in K&K.... not one.

[Chacal]

I had three of these at one time, icluding one stamped "Gaunt" on the slider: was never convinced any of them were right. If they turn up I'll post them here.

Graham

Hi Griff
I have a Military Foot Police Cap Badge maker J.R.GAUNT, i have medals to the MFP and MMP and find that the cap badge was a SHOULDER TITLE they used. i have never seen an original cap badge as i believe they never had one.
There is a thread on google search the history tells you.
Cheers Mike.

[GriffMJ]

Graham

Look forward to seeing them if you can dig them out

Mike

Well K&K do show an all brass..... its identical to a 1RD badge of the same period. I just think that it was a short lived badge before the common "wreath" version that we all know? I can believe that it was also used as a shoulder title..... but we would see them turn up from time to time if they were used in that way?

Two part brass badge in K&K..


The 1RD of the same period... (same Royal Crest and very similar scroll)