2 SOUTH AFRICAN BADGES - OPINION REQUIRED

[Alan O]

Please can I have an opinion on these 2. The Prince Alfred's Guard may have had a repair to a lug. The Wittersand Rifles has a FERMIN maker. Is this repro?

I would be grateful for an indication of price as I do not collect SA badges and want to sell them on.

[wright241]

Originally Posted by Alan O

Please can I have an opinion on these 2. The Prince Alfred's Guard may have had a repair to a lug. The Wittersand Rifles has a FERMIN maker. Is this repro?

I would be grateful for an indication of price as I do not collect SA badges and want to sell them on.

Can't say that I have seen that type of FIRMIN mark on any of my UK/Non UK badges. Price is something else, depends on the market/buyer.
David

[Milmed]

The PAG looks ok, but the WR I would say is a copy. First I have seen with a slider and I thought FIRMIN was spelt with an I and not an E (FERMIN)

Steven

[Alan O]

Steven

Thanks. Is it possible to date the PAG badge?

Alan

[Milmed]

Alan,
Depending on size, owen has it as a helmet badge(75mm) 1897 - 1939 and as a cap badge(45mm) 1922 - 1963.

Steven

[Alan O]

It is the smaller.

Thanks

Alan

[Brian Conyngham]

Alan

Found this: http://www.epicos.com/EPCompanyProfi....aspx?id=23388

Not sure when the Fermin group took over Gaunt however interesting.

Never seen one of these Wits Rifles badges before, looks well made however.

Brian

[Alan O]

Brian,

The British firn is FIRMIN with an I.

The badge has FERMIN which is a mark not seen before.

Alan

[Alex Rice]

Hi Alan
PAG badge I would consider paying about GBP8-10, and the other I am sure is a fake.
Cheers,
Alex

[Brian Conyngham]

Originally Posted by Alan O

Brian,

The British firn is FIRMIN with an I.

The badge has FERMIN which is a mark not seen before.

Alan

Alan

I know that the British firm is Firmin but what I was pointing out with my post, is that there is such a company/group as Fermin associated with badge manufacturing.

Brian

[Brian Conyngham]

Guys

The age old "fake or not" question once again rises it's ugly head.

From the replies so far this appears to be a "one off"....now why would someone spend a huge amount of money producing just one badge?

To make or at least recoup his money, the faker would have to make at least a few hundred. If this is the case, where are they?

We all know there is a small market in Colonial badges, therefore why fake these?

The badge shown appears to be well made, I am not saying it is correct BUT it certainly does not look new.

Comments most welcome.

Brian

[Alex Rice]

Hi Brian
Good question, but the big thing with this is the 'FERMIN' mark, which to me makes it very dodgy. I have heard that in WWII there were some badges made for SA servicemen in the UK and sometimes they made the wrong badges, so if it was a recognised mark, I'd consider that it may have been made under these circumstances.
Cheers,
Alex

[Milmed]

Hi Brian,
This Fermin and Firmin thing has plagued me for a while, so I did a bit of investigation. In the writeup on the link you provided I find reference to a 'fermin group'. Serching google with this I find a Fashion house called 'Fermin Group' in Hong Kong and an engineering firm in Switzerland. I dont see any connection to Gaunt in any of these.

So I went back to the link provided and see there is a link form here to "Firmin" website, so it is my opinion the the fermin mentioned in the supplied link may be a typing error done by epicos.com.

The firmin link on the epicos page actually takes you to FIRMINS website.

Address: 11 Brearley Street Aston Birmingham B19 3HF Great Britain
Phone No: +44 (0)121 380 0800
Fax No: +44(0)121 359 3321
e-mail: military@firmin.co.uk
Website: http://www.firmin.co.uk

So based on these findings I believe the FERMIN slider to be suspect.

Steven