19th Hussars (The Elephant Family).

[jeanpit-frenchy]

i think it is "impossible mission" for me to found a genuine, so i am pleased with a nice 4 GBP fake....

but it seems to me that i have read in this forum that old badges must have loops N.S and yours is E.O (but my english is no very good, perhaps i have dont understand very well...)

[Mike]

Here's my copy of the first type.

Noticed the same marks on the reverse of the animal's upper back on this badge as Malc's badge - out of the same die I think. wonder who is making these things?

[Malcolm Davey]

Hang on we can't say these are restrikes just because one person has their own personal opinion and has not provided any proof.
The black lugs on mine and the stamping i believe my badge is genuine.

Cheers
Malc

[Keith Blakeman]

Originally Posted by Administrator

your building my hopes up, tell me more

I personally think those where the tail is clearly separate from the body are fine, it's where there's a web between them the problem begins. There are a couple of different dies around for this badge which is surprising (or worrying!) for the small amount of time it was around.

The double scroll version is a real pain though, I'll post a picture of one bought by a dealer on ebay in a mo. Here's my single scroll for comparison first.

[Sonofacqms]

As I have said before, without handling the badge you can never be 100% sure, but if I saw either of these badges on ebay, I would not add them to "my watching list", the double scroll 19th is a very rare badge, I have never handled a real one in 55 years.

[dragonz18]

A possible interesting point here,though there was probably more than one manufacturer/style at that time.
The double scroll 'friendlier looking' elephant shown in Gaylor's book is actually more like Frenchy's badge(possibly cast copy of an origional ?) than any others shown here.With the prominant forehead bump & no extra shoulder hump along the top line of the animal's back.
Something I've always looked for, but never seen yet ,in the 'wild'.
Cheers !
Steve

[jeanpit-frenchy]

Originally Posted by Sonofacqms

As I have said before, without handling the badge you can never be 100% sure, but if I saw either of these badges on ebay, I would not add them to "my watching list", the double scroll 19th is a very rare badge, I have never handled a real one in 55 years.

KIPLING AND KING vol 2 , page 225 about restrikes...

"""....for instance, a cast specimen of the elephant/double-scroll pattern of the 19th hussars (KK790): collectors in those days knew that their chance of obtaining an original of such a badge well-nigh negligible....""""""

[LONGSHANKS]

Saw this for sale recently. Any comments, I believe it is a very bad copy. And, any idea on the price for a real double scroll version as I know where I can get one from; but not sure on the price.

[Frank Kelley]

Copy?

Originally Posted by Mike

Here's my copy of the first type.

Noticed the same marks on the reverse of the animal's upper back on this badge as Malc's badge - out of the same die I think. wonder who is making these things?

[GriffMJ]

Nice one with a slider on Bosleys new site.

[Frank Kelley]

Morning Griff,
My own thoughts on these badges are that they were worn well beyond 1902, if they are wrong, what did the regiment actually wear?
Regards Frank

[GriffMJ]

Frank

The 19H is another of my favourites ... I have been trying to collect images for them that can be dated but very few exist where a badge can be seen. The badges that I would obviously trust are the "correctly" HMd silver officers badges ..... and from those .... work out the dates and then find the ORs that match them. We know the double scroll exists... because we have the Officers badge to prove that.... I cant remember the HM date on it..... but I think we do know that it was not in service for long before it changed to the single scroll. The amount of Other Ranks badges made for the double scroll must have been in the low numbers .... because we just dont see them. I think there are three or four Other Ranks variants for the double scroll that all claim to be real. Wilkinson's book shows one particular type that is very stylized..... but is it genuine?

These images are close to the 2nd Boer War..... frustrating though as the Officers and ORs are wearing the sewn on Nelly.... not the cap badge :-

[Frank Kelley]

That is not a copy.

Originally Posted by Mike

Here's my copy of the first type.

Noticed the same marks on the reverse of the animal's upper back on this badge as Malc's badge - out of the same die I think. wonder who is making these things?

[Alan O]

http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/for...ictureid=93589

A really good picture of the single scroll elephant badge in use on the slouch hat. The badge went out of use in 1902 as the regiment returned to UK and the elephant was not worn on pill box hats.

[3748 Hussar]

Hi All,

After discussions with other forum members I thought I should post the much talked about 19th Hussars double scrolled strike.

I have posted 2 variants, see attached photos. All thoughts and views much appreciated.

3748 Hussar