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  #256  
Old 26-03-21, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by dumdum View Post

Interesting that my nickel plated badge carries the "fire gilt" backstamp.

Any comments on the enameled badge?

I'm sure that these nickeled/ enameled badges had some function to indicate seniority or status
My view is that these are 'post production' variations as the nickel/silver/chrome badges appear to be standard badges (by various manufacturers and different series) that have been 'plated' after the number has been stamped on the rear (either on horseshoe fitting or directly on the Wooley examples).

Regarding certain badges being seniority/status related , I personally feel there is no evidence to back this up. While it is possible that certain factories may have wanted to differentiate between levels of staff , it is probable that individuals simply wanted to 'enhance' their own badges (possibly after their employment finished).

It is worth remembering that Tom Tulloch-Marshall (2001) , and later Tony James (2012) , both were of the opinion that the series letters on the 1915 OWS badges were possibly indications of the trade/position of the employee. This 'theory' is no longer accepted but shows that even 9 years ago there were details about these badges that further research has shown to be inaccurate.

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  #257  
Old 26-03-21, 09:52 PM
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Hi Leigh

Thanks for that. Don't you just love the iconography of the winged cherub (putti?) with flaming cornucopia that, presumably, contains phosphorus!

His attire must have led him to get a little burnt from time to time....

As I posted this, I was reminded how, when I got it off eB*y, I had a sweet note from the seller apologising for the delay in sending as she had been temporarily banned from the site for selling something with a Nazi connection.

Anyway, medal arrived in fairly short order. How I miss those days.....
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  #258  
Old 26-03-21, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike_vee View Post
My view is that these are 'post production' variations as the nickel/silver/chrome badges appear to be standard badges (by various manufacturers and different series) that have been 'plated' after the number has been stamped on the rear (either on horseshoe fitting or directly on the Wooley examples).

Regarding certain badges being seniority/status related , I personally feel there is no evidence to back this up. While it is possible that certain factories may have wanted to differentiate between levels of staff , it is probable that individuals simply wanted to 'enhance' their own badges (possibly after their employment finished).

It is worth remembering that Tom Tulloch-Marshall (2001) , and later Tony James (2012) , both were of the opinion that the series letters on the 1915 OWS badges were possibly indications of the trade/position of the employee. This 'theory' is no longer accepted but shows that even 9 years ago there were details about these badges that further research has shown to be inaccurate.

.
Hi Mike

Another great informative post. Thanks for that.

I would think that seniority within the work place would have been indicated by something more visible such as an armband as it would be impractical to have to put your specs on to see that Mr Bloggs has a plated badge so he's the one I need to ask.

My question to anyone out there: have you seen another 1915 enameled badge? There must be more than one of them!
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  #259  
Old 26-03-21, 10:00 PM
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Oh yes, the old letter = trade classification debate. Can't see how this could possibly have worked....

Maybe one day we'll know more!
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  #260  
Old 26-03-21, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chipper View Post
Correct Mike, and the only maker (I think?) to punch the numbers on the badge itself

As for the "best" you are also right I think, only ever seen them on that issuer.

cheers, Tim
Hi Tim

Hope all well with you. When I see the 1915 renumbered badges, the renumbering is usually on the horseshoe fitting. My guess is that it would be virtually impossible to erase a number stamped into the reverse of a badge.

One of our veteran's associations from a certain area heavily stamped the badges almost like a serial number on a machine whereas other areas lightly engraved them.

The engraved badges could be renumbered and reissued, the stamped badges....NEVER.
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  #261  
Old 20-04-21, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Chipper View Post
Picked up this last week off ebay (thanks CharlieDog), a nice and hard to find "V" issue with a rubbery disk I've not seen before.
There is a Mappin & Webb "R" series badge "with original leather backing and box" on eBay at the moment .

So now we've seen examples of metal , rubber and leather discs . These were possibly common items at the time but were later discarded if the material perished or they were mistaken for washers etc.

I have downloaded photos for future reference .

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Last edited by mike_vee; 20-04-21 at 09:18 AM.
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  #262  
Old 25-04-21, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by mike_vee View Post
There is a Mappin & Webb "R" series badge "with original leather backing and box" on eBay at the moment .
It just went for £59.00 !

Two bidders were after it , so price shot up.

A couple of photos.

.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Mappin & Webb 1915 Leather Disc 1.jpg (44.8 KB, 23 views)
File Type: jpg Mappin & Webb 1915 Leather 2.jpg (74.7 KB, 24 views)
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  #263  
Old 26-04-21, 10:42 AM
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Hi Mike

I finally found it and was thinking of bidding but Lord Sugar beat me to it....

I certainly wouldn't have gone to that figure! Wonder if he would like some of my "doubles"?
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  #264  
Old 26-04-21, 01:17 PM
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I finally found it and was thinking of bidding
I had it on my "watch list" but didn't bother bidding when I saw 2 others were going for it ... big time !

There is a very nice hallmarked silver enamelled "For War Service" fob/medallion (blue outer ring and green leaf wreath) I'm 'watching' at the moment but bids have already reached £51.00 and there are still 6 days to go.

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  #265  
Old 26-04-21, 03:15 PM
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The silver medallion is a lovely item and is drawing interest but I fear that the bidding will be too rich for me. However, I shall watch with interest from the sidelines.
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  #266  
Old 26-04-21, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Charliedog012012 View Post
The silver medallion is a lovely item and is drawing interest but I fear that the bidding will be too rich for me. However, I shall watch with interest from the sidelines.
A similar (possibly the same one ?) was in a 2016 Lockdale's Auction with a guide price of £60.00 - £65.00 but looks like it didn't sell as it was not on the 'prices realised' list .

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  #267  
Old 02-05-21, 06:47 PM
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Well, it certainly drew some interest on eBay..........someone was really keen. It went for £161 !!!...phew!!!!
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  #268  
Old 03-05-21, 07:30 AM
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I saw that , 2 bidders going for it ..... then someone who had earlier made one bid (£35.00) jumped in at the last second and beat them both !

Was surprised there wasn't more interest in "THE VC FACTORY" (National Shell Filling Factory No. 6, Chilwell) badge , it ended up going for £30.99.

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  #269  
Old Yesterday, 03:09 AM
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Mike, I checked your “War Service “ album, did not see this badge there. Is it just a factory worker’s badge, not necessarily “War Time”?. If so, what era and is it traceable?
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File Type: jpg 3D832DF4-60F7-44AB-9031-4FE2A953385A.jpg (45.5 KB, 8 views)
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  #270  
Old Yesterday, 08:23 AM
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When WW1 broke out numerous factories/companies produced their own "War Service" badges , the system was abused and the government stepped in.

Quote:
On the 27th March 1915, the War Office issued a memorandum about the 1915 and 1914 badges to recruiting officers, stressing that these were the only official badges. Private badges were still being issued by companies but these would not provide the wearer with any protection from accusations of “shirking and slacking” and did not enable the wearer to avoid compulsory military service, which was introduced in 1916.
British “On War Service” Badges 1914-1919


The Woolwich badge you posted is from WW2 , there "should" be a record somewhere of who it was issued to but a lot of paperwork was either lost or destroyed.

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