Library and Archives Canada

[chaudiere1944]

I will be visiting Ottawa on business for a couple days at then end of the month and while there want to go for my first Visit to the Library and Archives Canada.

I have my User Card and I have roughly 34 items that I want to access that I found from their website. Any advice that anyone can offer for my LAC visit to make it more fruitful?

Best,
Mike

[Bill A]

Hi Mike, I believe you can pre-order these items. I would certainly investigate that option. Many records are not kept on site, and have to be ordered in.
What are you researching? Personell files or regimental material?

[chaudiere1944]

Hi Bill,

I was hoping to access the War Diary of Le Regiment de la Chaudiere and additionally I want to view and perhaps have reproduced a number of Photographs that do not have a link on their website (approx. 30 items). I will also try and have a look at my Grandfathers service file.

I just finished chatting with someone at LAC and she suggested that due to the amount of info I was looking for, that rather than try to do it all at once that I do a bit at a time because according to her you are only allowed to access/order 10 items from their website at a time. I think that is what I will do...having never been there before I better not try to 'bite off more than I can chew".



Mike

[Bill A]

Hi Mike, IIRC, the war diaries are not on site and have to be ordered in. I wonder if they may be worth copying in their entirity for your research? That can be ordered, rather than examined.

[Recce]

Mr Bill is correct many documents can't be viewed on LAC. As example CHMQ Reports many need to order. Many documents you must apply to get permission, can't Photo Copy as war diaries can only be viewed and read by Appointment as other documents, while others they have available on the LAC site,.

You can also put the pieces together form D-Day to The Breskens Pocket and so on, like I did for The Black Watch. Took me years to gather Primary Source accounts all the Maps of Canadian advances as battles throughout Normandy, Belgium, Netherlands as Germany and the Italian campaign. Every Year on remembrance day I talk to my Regiments WWII Vets, or check the Legion Le Chaudiere vets many hang out at one legion they have many vets the beer is cheap and you get first hand accounts from The Second World War.


See Juno Beach Center.

Whoever Le Régiment de la Chaudière
Le Régiment de la Chaudière was a French Canadian regiment from the province of Quebec. Their task on D-Day was to pass through the Queen's Own Rifles (QOR) and head south until they ran into the Germans. They landed near Bernières at 8:30. Coming in on the rising tide, many of the landing craft struck concealed mines. 'A' Company had four of its five LCA's damaged. The occupants had no option but to throw off their equipment and swim to shore. The Chaudière's reorganized behind the beach wall while the QOR cleared the remaining German resistance in Bernières. They then moved to their assembly area in the wooded area on the south edge of Bernières . Along the way they were greeted by the locals who were surprised and delighted to learn they spoke French.


http://www.members.shaw.ca/junobeach/juno-4-3.htm


trying to cut round the rear, had encountered the Regiment de la Chaudiere, resulting in an enemy loss of many men
and seventeen half-tracks, and their final withdrawl for the night.

http://www.junobeach.org/e/2/can-eve-rod-nor-bur-e.htm



Canadian Participation In The World War II Battle To Win The Breskens Pocket: Army, Part 35
March 1, 2001, by Terry Copp

This manoeuvre caught the enemy by surprise. The Queen’s Own Rifles took over Biervliet and launched a powerful thrust that cracked through the enemy. Joined by the North Shores and Le Régiment de la Chaudière, the QORs advanced rapidly linking up with 4th Div. on Oct. 15. The divisional engineers immediately went to work clearing minefields, exploding obstacles and improving road beds. The forces inside the pocket could now be guaranteed adequate supplies.

http://www.legionmagazine.com/en/ind...eskens-pocket/


Canadian Regiments stationed in Worthing Area one was, Le Régiment de la Chaudière.


Theres a Book Called "Le Regiment de la Chaudiere"
Castonguary, Jacques and Armand Ross.
Beauceville, Quebec: Imprimerie L'Eclaireur, 1983



Infantrymen of Le Régiment de la Chaudière moving through the village, 6 June 1944.


.

[chaudiere1944]

Thanks Bill for the advice...I will see if I can order the War Diary and have it copied in its entirety.

I also e-mailed the Canadian War Museum today...specifically the Curator for Dress/Insignia asking whether I could visit and inspect privately their collection of Chaudiere artifacts...I am awaiting a reply. Anyone know if this is even possible or am I dreaming in technicolour?

Recce...thanks for your post. I actually plan on piecing together their history as you did with the Black Watch using the War Diary and information I already have in my collection including the book you recommended by Castonguay/Ross (1983) and also I have the rare (only 2000 copies) Le Geste du Regiment de la Chaudiere (1945) by Ross/Gauvin. I wish I was able to go to the Legion's in Quebec and converse with the Veterans but alas 2 things make it very difficult...one being I live in the Toronto area and two, in spite of being half Acadian my French language skills are very primitive.


Mike

[Recce]

Originally Posted by chaudiere1944

Thanks Bill for the advice...I will see if I can order the War Diary and have it copied in its entirety.

I also e-mailed the Canadian War Museum today...specifically the Curator for Dress/Insignia asking whether I could visit and inspect privately their collection of Chaudiere artifacts...I am awaiting a reply. Anyone know if this is even possible or am I dreaming in technicolour?

Recce...thanks for your post. I actually plan on piecing together their history as you did with the Black Watch using the War Diary and information I already have in my collection including the book you recommended by Castonguay/Ross (1983) and also I have the rare (only 2000 copies) Le Geste du Regiment de la Chaudiere (1945) by Ross/Gauvin. I wish I was able to go to the Legion's in Quebec and converse with the Veterans but alas 2 things make it very difficult...one being I live in the Toronto area and two, in spite of being half Acadian my French language skills are very primitive.


Mike

Mr Mike even with the war Diary you need to put the Pieces together with a Wide brush and a fine brush for accuracy. Let me explain, Personal War Diaries, Regiment Diaries, Primary Source accounts or secondary. Books written by many world renowned historians through the years have embellish as inaccurate Accounts, and found a few in The Black Watch O.R. War Diary, CHMQ reports have account that are falsified, the majority of all casualties counts are inaccurate. As Example Bloody Omaha, estimated at 2500-3000 by all historians as a great success, when in fact now estimated near 5,000 US Casualties. War History is usually written by the winners not the losers, and one has to maneuver through all the Clutter, I believe in finding the truth first before Pride an Honour.

Half of "The Unnecessary War" has been chiseled in Granite and can't be debunked, the other half is still debatable.


First you need is All Canadian Movements maps, as every Operation they Participated in until the end of the War, Personally Start with 1939-35.


Map Falaise Pocket

http://warchronicle.com/16th_infantr...cketDetail.jpg


OP Overlord

http://www.cromwell-intl.com/travel/...sion_Force.jpg

http://amhist.ist.unomaha.edu/module...-day%20Map.jpg


Caen;

http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/C...Victory-11.jpg

http://warandgame.files.wordpress.co...2/mapsedrr.jpg


OP Totalise, British Sources spell it with a S Not Z.

http://wwii.ca/maps/totalize.jpg

http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/C.../Victory-4.jpg


D-Day Map landings

http://ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/Canad.../Victory-2.jpg

http://wwii.ca/maps/normandy_dday.jpg


Adriatic Sea Sectore Aug 44- Feb 45.
http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/C...s/OpSumm-6.jpg

.

[servicepub]

Originally Posted by Recce

.. As example CHMQ Reports many need to order. Many documents you must apply to get permission, can't Photo Copy as war diaries can only be viewed and read by Appointment as other documents, while others they have available on the LAC site.

Not quite.
First, CMHQ Reports are specific historical summaries assembled/written by the CMHQ Historical Section. These are all on-line at the DHH site. Originals can be viewed and self-copied (free of charge) at DHH. Public access is only Tuesday and Wednesday and they are in an obscure building on Holly Lane, In Ottawa's East end.
All Second World War War Diaries are available, but require 24 hours to order as they are off-site. In fact, nearly everything requires 24 hours. The War Diaries can be photocopied by LAC bt the cost is high per page and there are a lot of pages. If you bring a digital camera though, you can take a photo of every page. You can complete a form that allows you to do this in the evening also.
If you wish to view photos go to the Special Collections area (on the 3rd Floor) and ask to see the "Red Books". There are 110 volumes of contact sheets and, again, you can use your digital camera to take copies of these. The first 10-12 volumes are 35mm and don't photograph well but the remainder are large format contact sheets and you can get decent images for your private use.
If you order 10 items prior to your visit then on the first day you go to LAC order the remainder right away. These will be available to you the following day. You can get storage lockers which will hold these while you are in town. They also allow you to go in for evening work.
I may be out of town at the end of the month but call/PM me and I can guide you around the vagaries of LAC (I work just a couple of streets away.)
Clive

[Pylon1357]

I for one can vouch for Clive and his knowledge in regards to locating and navigating the National Library and Archives Canada.

IIRC Clive the Archives was the first place we met face to face??

[regimentalrogue]

Canadian Military Headquarters (CMHQ) Reports 1940-1948

[Recce]

Originally Posted by servicepub

Not quite.
First, CMHQ Reports are specific historical summaries assembled/written by the CMHQ Historical Section. These are all on-line at the DHH site. Originals can be viewed and self-copied (free of charge) at DHH. Public access is only Tuesday and Wednesday and they are in an obscure building on Holly Lane, In Ottawa's East end.
All Second World War War Diaries are available, but require 24 hours to order as they are off-site. In fact, nearly everything requires 24 hours. The War Diaries can be photocopied by LAC bt the cost is high per page and there are a lot of pages. If you bring a digital camera though, you can take a photo of every page. You can complete a form that allows you to do this in the evening also.
If you wish to view photos go to the Special Collections area (on the 3rd Floor) and ask to see the "Red Books". There are 110 volumes of contact sheets and, again, you can use your digital camera to take copies of these. The first 10-12 volumes are 35mm and don't photograph well but the remainder are large format contact sheets and you can get decent images for your private use.
If you order 10 items prior to your visit then on the first day you go to LAC order the remainder right away. These will be available to you the following day. You can get storage lockers which will hold these while you are in town. They also allow you to go in for evening work.
I may be out of town at the end of the month but call/PM me and I can guide you around the vagaries of LAC (I work just a couple of streets away.)
Clive

Well I think the 1000+++hrs on the LAC Site plus all the visits to Ottawa I was misinformed. 24hrs on most Documents as Diaries is nice when your in Ottawa and your close, when you live in Montreal I had to send them Requests to view certain Documents and over a week it took for confirmation on the Date I was allowed to View them. Please go to the LAC Site they tell you it could take weeks even Wait over a month when your ordering, Pictures as Documents Diaries ect. Not all Original documents can be Photocopied or Diaries unless they have a Copy already available and your taking a picture from that, yes your right the photocopies are WOW expensive just like the pictures at $12.00 each for small ones.

I have over 2000 Pictures from the LAC that are available, Whoever many others have not yet been developed, not count the 1000++ that are still in Negative format and that goes for the Film footage that is still in boxes gathering dust for 60 yrs. It could be true that your allowed to take your Digital Camera for the pictures, but not for certain documents++++++, they specifically told me the flash destroys the documents and told I was not allowed.

Derectorate of history heritage DHH
National defence Headquarters
101 colonel by drive
Ottawa Ont
kia ok2
FAX; 613 990-8579


Colonel Charles P. Stacey Building,
2429 Holly Lane, Ottawa, Ontario.
Ottawa, Ontario
Canada K1A 0K2
FAX: (613) 990-8579


Thanks for the heads-Up whoever I know what a CMHQ report is, I have many on PDF.

Not all can be found as example or are available.

■Title: The Black Watch (Royal Highland Regt) of Canada in OPERATION "SPRING", 25 Jul 44.
■Date of Publication: 12 Feb 1946
■Version: PDF
■File Size: 2.85 MB
■Type: CMHQ Report
■Report #: 150
■Author: Stacey, C.P.

If you can show me a link or can you get a Copy would be greatly appreciated, I will pay for Shipping. Or if you have it on PDF just @ me a copy.

The Bottom link I've been many times and about 30++ Reports can't be Downloaded or Viewed on PDF.


http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhh-...-rqgmc-eng.asp

[Recce]

Originally Posted by Pylon1357

I for one can vouch for Clive and his knowledge in regards to locating and navigating the National Library and Archives Canada.

IIRC Clive the Archives was the first place we met face to face??

I can Vouch On Mr Clives Knowledge, navigating in the LAC also The knowledge of "The RED BOOKs" was enough proof for Moi!

[Bill A]

Mike, Clive has given one of the best suggestions for research. A digital camera is THE TOOL for copies of the documents. (I didn't click on that for the War Diary, but that is an inexpensive and quick way to get the documents that you need.)
Digital images of docs are easy to store (Make sure you back up a couple of ways. I just got a huge batch of images, some I think from some of the same stuff you are looking at, and a pile of images were corrupted. (They were into the drugs... digitalis...). I have three copies of them now, one on an external backup for "permanent" storage.
The one drawback is "using" digital images. With photocopies you could approach the research / compilation / writing etc in one way, but digital images require a different approach. Takes a bit of getting used to.
Hi Recce, your comments about research are appreciated. It is important to remember that other individuals have extensive knowledge of LAC. Clive has written several books and articles based upon extensive research at the archives. He, and others, have an intimate knowledge of the way the archives work, and the fact that there are ways of getting information from archives (that we who are at some distance from Ottawa can not access), that make it easier for an infrequent visitor to the LAC to have a productive visit.

[chaudiere1944]

Hi All,

Some incredible advice has been provided and I will be definitely taking my Digital Camera along with a lot of Batteries!!!

For my first visit to the LAC, I will set my Goals at a reasonable level...I recall when I did my M.A. Thesis I wanted to accomplish everything at once and quickly realized that a more measured, patient and realistic approach was warranted in acquiring the volumes of information that I eventually sourced.

Again thank you all for pitching in...it has given me the insights and edge that I was looking/hoping for.

I am very impressed by the generosity of this Forum.

Mike Kennelly

[Recce]

Originally Posted by Bill A

Hi Recce, your comments about research are appreciated. It is important to remember that other individuals have extensive knowledge of LAC. Clive has written several books and articles based upon extensive research at the archives. He, and others, have an intimate knowledge of the way the archives work, and the fact that there are ways of getting information from archives (that we who are at some distance from Ottawa can not access), that make it easier for an infrequent visitor to the LAC to have a productive visit.

Yes many others might have extensive knowledge of the Lac. Whoever So do I, the 1000 hours was a gross understatement.

Mr. Clive stated that all CMHQ reports++++ can be found on line, I personally no thats not accurate.

He stated with in 24hrs that's also not entirely correct, in many cases yes the 24hrs apply if your in Ottawa. Whoever maybe for him since his well known due to the Books his written on the LAC and the fact his in Ottawa does help tremendously. I had to send them Requests to view certain Documents and over a week it took for confirmation on the Date I was allowed to View them, and if I didn't make it for that date I have to reply. I was not allowed to take any Pictures of those documents, since they were the originals. The LAC has also a big shortage on Staff , been told that many times.

This info is from the LAC; 5 working days prior to your visit, Provided you have a User Card Number.

This online service allows you to order material in advance of your visit to Library and Archives Canada (LAC). You may order a maximum of ten items (i.e.: books, boxes of archival documents, video-tapes, etc.) and you must submit your request at least five working days prior to your visit.

You must:

•Provide your user card number. If you do not have one, complete the online User Card Registration Form. You will receive your user card number by email within two working days.

•Provide an email address and a phone or fax number where you can be reached from 9:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m., Monday to Friday. We will contact you if the documents you are ordering are not available or the archival or bibliographical references are incomplete.

The Bottom Link takes you to there opening hours Service and Opening Hours.

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/v...01-1000-e.html


I will call them Mana since I need some info on Pictures I just found they have but have never been developed. And I will ask concerning Taking Pictures with your Owen Digital Camera++++, I know for photocopies of documents not a Problem.