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  #1  
Old 19-05-08, 10:33 PM
dak580 dak580 is offline
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Default Metal v Staybrite

G'day members

Living in the land down under I get very little chance to see let alone feel the new British Army badges. So I was hoping members could answer a few questions?

I have noticed with the few ‘new’ regimental badges I have purchased that they appear to be moving away from the a/a staybrite material into a more substantial metal.

So my questions are

Are there plans to get all British regiments badges made in metal rather than staybrite or will some continue being made and worn in a/a?

If so what new regiments have members seen metal and what regiments are still a/a?

Have any of the new regimental badges changed size/colour with the new amalgamations?

Are there anymore amalgamations or disbandments in the pipeline in the near future?

Should the Queens Royal Lancers cap badge have crossed lancers behind the motto?
I always thought this was the old 17th arm badge but have seen it advertised recently as a cap badge.

Cheers
John
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  #2  
Old 20-05-08, 12:17 AM
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hagwalther hagwalther is offline
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Hi John,

I'll be keen to get answers here too as I'm trying to find out the timeline of manufacture of staybrite badges.

This will be a thread for me to watch.

Regards

Chris
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  #3  
Old 20-05-08, 08:36 AM
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Alan O Alan O is offline
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John,

The MOD has been no longer ordering a/a badges for a few years. Various regts have been created recently and they have ordered badge in improved metals. The PWRR have gone for a Bronzed badge while others have gone for gilt, silvered metal or enamel badges. Other regts have changed their designs and used that change to introduce a better quality badge. for example the QLR introduced a new design in 2003 and the RLC issued a new badge (same pattern but improved metals) to coincide with their 10 year anniversary.

To muddy the waters further some regts do not wear the issued a/a badges but buy them privately and the soldiers buy their own from the Regtl PRI shop. This is particularly prevelent in the cavalry and parachute regiments but is not unheard of eleswhere.

All existing regtl badges will be in future made in improved metals but existing a/a stocks will be used up first. These are now beginning to filter through and you saw several infantry badges with the new badges shortly before they amalgamated and got a new design anyway.

All the new regts created in the last round of amalgamations have improved metal badges. There are no plans (in the public arena anyway) for any more amlgamations.

Alan

Last edited by Alan O; 20-05-08 at 08:53 AM.
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  #4  
Old 20-05-08, 09:02 AM
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hagwalther hagwalther is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Owen View Post
John,

The MOD has been no longer ordering a/a badges for a few years. Various regts have been created recently and they have ordered badge in improved metals. The PWRR have gone for a Bronzed badge while others have gone for gilt, silvered metal or enamel badges. Other regts have changed their designs and used that change to introduce a better quality badge. for example the QLR introduced a new design in 2003 and the RLC issued a new badge (same pattern but improved metals) to coincide with their 10 year anniversary.

To muddy the waters further some regts do not wear the issued a/a badges but buy them privately and the soldiers buy their own from the Regtl PRI shop. This is particularly prevelent in the cavalry and parachute regiments but is not unheard of eleswhere.

All existing regtl badges will be in future made in improved metals but existing a/a stocks will be used up first. These are now beginning to filter through and you saw several infantry badges with the new badges shortly before they amalgamated and got a new design anyway.

All the new regts created in the last round of amalgamations have improved metal badges. There are no plans (in the public arena anyway) for any more amlgamations.

Alan
Hi Alan,

Do you know the date the last badge was procured was and for whom?

Regards

Chris
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  #5  
Old 20-05-08, 09:08 AM
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Jibba Jabba Jibba Jabba is offline
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Quote:
Should the Queens Royal Lancers cap badge have crossed lancers behind the motto?
I always thought this was the old 17th arm badge but have seen it advertised recently as a cap badge.
There should be lances behind the motto, however many members of the former regiment particulary the 17/21st wore their old badges and when the new badges with lances were issued they snapped the lances off!

That snippet came from a very reputable source.
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  #6  
Old 20-05-08, 10:43 AM
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The QRL cap badges do not have lances today. They are identical to the 17/21st Lancers badge. There was talk of adding lances to the regtl badge and you see this on some paperwork but the cap badge stayed as it was.

The 17/21st Lancer Officers and ORs continued to wear near identical uniforms and badges post amalgamtion with the exception of the Regtl s/t, collars and rank slide title.

Alan

Last edited by Alan O; 20-05-08 at 11:10 AM.
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  #7  
Old 20-05-08, 12:28 PM
oc14 oc14 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jibba Jabba View Post
There should be lances behind the motto, however many members of the former regiment particulary the 17/21st wore their old badges and when the new badges with lances were issued they snapped the lances off!

That snippet came from a very reputable source.
Suggest that you have a word with your "very reputable source". As Alan says, QRL badge are not and never have been made with Lances. I work with several members of the Regiment. The only place where Lances are worn behind the badge are on the TRF (Tactical Recongnition Flash) and on the Sgt's Mess Kit bullion embroidered arm badge.

By the way, regimental custom in the QRL dictates that it is not referred to as a cap badge but as the MOTTO (also sometimes referred to as Chad).

The new regiment adopted the Motto of the 17th/21st Lancers, the collar badges of the 16th/5th Lancers, buttons from the 17th/21st and New shoulder titles reading QRL

Paul
OC14
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  #8  
Old 20-05-08, 11:17 AM
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Alan O Alan O is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hagwalther View Post
Hi Alan,

Do you know the date the last badge was procured was and for whom?

Regards

Chris
Chris,

I don't have an exact date for the ADC decision but it was around 2003. Certainly the old designs (such as LI and Yorkshire Regt) can be found in improved metals with that date on the manufacturers packaging. There was no sudden switch over and for example the Argylles, BW and KOSB were still wearing a/a on amalgamation into the RRS where as the Highlanders were already wearing the improved metal badges on their NCOs and ORs No1 Dress bonnets. While some Bns (such as the QLR with their new badge) had done away with a/a even some of the new designs were not being universally worn within the Bn on amlgamation. I certainly saw the Kings wearing both the small and large horse badges at the same time in 2003.

Alan
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  #9  
Old 20-05-08, 07:04 PM
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Mike H Mike H is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Owen View Post
Chris,

I don't have an exact date for the ADC decision but it was around 2003. Certainly the old designs (such as LI and Yorkshire Regt) can be found in improved metals with that date on the manufacturers packaging. There was no sudden switch over and for example the Argylles, BW and KOSB were still wearing a/a on amalgamation into the RRS where as the Highlanders were already wearing the improved metal badges on their NCOs and ORs No1 Dress bonnets. While some Bns (such as the QLR with their new badge) had done away with a/a even some of the new designs were not being universally worn within the Bn on amlgamation. I certainly saw the Kings wearing both the small and large horse badges at the same time in 2003.

Alan
MPSC started to wear metal badges made by AMMO UK around 1999.At the time we asked if they were genuine due to the maker and was told yes they are genuine issue.
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  #10  
Old 20-05-08, 07:47 PM
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hagwalther hagwalther is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Owen View Post
Chris,

I don't have an exact date for the ADC decision but it was around 2003.

Alan
Thanks Alan,

I'm going to move this information to the definition.

Looks like we have a final time line to 2003 or at least 'approx. 2003'.

All we need now is a start time line.

Regards

Chris
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  #11  
Old 13-01-09, 11:15 PM
Chrisr Chrisr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Owen View Post
John,

the QLR introduced a new design in 2003
Alan,

I assume the changes in the design were minor, can you expand on what they were?

Regards
Chris
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  #12  
Old 14-01-09, 09:19 AM
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Alan O Alan O is offline
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Chris.
A picture paints a thousand words.

The a/a 1970 badge is on the right. Later ones had the rose in red and this was often painted in by the soldiers.

The 2003 gilt/enamel one is a new design and much higher quality. There were a couple of makers and the rose comes in 2 shaes of red. The backing is primrose yellow and the earlier ones were made of yellow plastic. This one is foam.

Alan
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  #13  
Old 14-01-09, 10:32 AM
Chrisr Chrisr is offline
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Alan,

Many thanks.

Cheers
Chris
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  #14  
Old 14-01-09, 08:15 PM
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GriffMJ GriffMJ is offline
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The Royal Yeomanry has, what appears to be, a plated metal badge. Its not the same quality as the original brass badges of the County Yeomanry Squadrons that make up the Regiment.... but is better than the AA badges.

The Royal Mercian Yeomanry has and enamled badge that looks more like a pin badge..... but better than the AA.

The best Yeomanry badges I have seen are the Queens Own Yeomanry (running fox) ..... and my favourite is the A sqn (Dorset Yeomanry) RWxY..... this is a well designed badge. This badge is also an enamled badge.

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  #15  
Old 14-01-09, 08:56 PM
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Alan O Alan O is offline
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My Yeomanry holdings of post a/a badges are:

Obselete:

Scottish Yeo - S/G
Westminster Dragoons - Silver plate
QOYY(LI)

Current:

A Sqn WxY (Dorsetshire Yeomanry)
QOY - NCOs badge Bi metal private purchase. (much copied)
Royal Mercian yeo


Absent is the Royal yeomanry mentioned above.
Alan
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