Royal Welsh Fusiliers (23rd Foot) 1850

[highlandas]

Hello all,

Members of the 23rd Foot (Reserve Battalion) lost their lives on Lake Erie when the Canadian steamer Commerce sunk off the coast of Port Maitland, Ontario. My father is trying to replace the grave marker for these fine gentlemen and create a small display.

I am trying to locate images (maybe a badge) of the 23rd as they were during this period.
If any of you who are formally of the Royal Welsh Regiment or collectors of this unit have anything that may help in creating of a true representation of the Regiment during this period. Drawing of the King's Colours, uniform, etc.

My father has been in contact with the Reg. HQ Royal Welsh Regiment, however I thought I would reach out.

Chris
williamcwarnick@cogeco.ca

[highlandas]

Hello all,

Members of the 23rd Foot (Reserve Battalion) lost their lives on Lake Erie when the Canadian steamer Commerce sunk off the coast of Port Maitland, Ontario. My father is trying to replace the grave marker for these fine gentlemen and create a small display.

I am trying to locate images (maybe a badge) of the 23rd as they were during this period.
If any of you who are formally of the Royal Welsh Regiment or collectors of this unit have anything that may help in creating of a true representation of the Regiment during this period. Drawing of the King's Colours, uniform, etc.

My father has been in contact with the Reg. HQ Royal Welsh Regiment, however I thought I would reach out.

Chris
williamcwarnick@cogeco.ca

[2747andy]

Chris,
have you been in contact with CWGC?

http://www.cwgc.org/

Andy

[highlandas]

2747 Andy

Hello Andy,

Just checked out the link. Yes we have talked to CWGC and they said unfortunately they only deal with WW1 froward.

Chris

[41st]

Chris,
You are getting a bit mixed up here.
The 23rd were a regular line Battn., nothing to do with reserve.
Some dates would be helpful and I think you may be referring to the Welsh Regiment rather than the RWF.
Hwyl,
Kevin

[JerryBB]

Hi Kevin,

According to "that astonishing Infantry" pp70-71 "In 1842 the government desperate for troops....whereby the four depot companies of some regiments were increased to six and dubbed reserve battalions....which was shipped off to Canada until 1853....In 1850 the Reserve Battalion had suffered a tragic loss when a Steamer accident on Lake Erie had resulted in the deaths of the Assistant /surgeon, three sergeants, two corporals, nineteen privates and eight wives...the officers mess silver was also lost...."

[Jeff Mc William]

Hi JB , Kevin, & highlandas
Yes, in April 1842 the Government created six new "Reserve Battalions" for the purpose of facilitating the relief of regiments abroad and shortening their periods of foriegn service. These were raised by increasing the strength of the Depot Companies and were in effect a cheap 2nd Battalion.
They had no Colonel, no Band, no Colours, and no Flank Coys*. Eventually the number of Reserve Battalions was increased to (about) 19, the 23rd Foot being one of the first six. They were all classed as Regular Line Battalions. By about 1854 most had disappeared, (some becoming full 2nd Battns of the regiments concerned ) but it is recorded that the 12th Foot kept their Res Battn until 1858. Hope this clarifies the issue. Regards Jeff

*Flank Coys were later added.

[highlandas]

Thank you, after the mention of 23rd Batt., I went back to my Dad's notes. Jerry and Jeff have the right info. So what cap badge would this battalion wear? With the lack of Colours, a Colonel, and band what would the troops rally to. Currently there is a flat stone that is in disrepair, and these man and their families are going be be lost in time. The local historical society investigating in providing a new monument with the cap badge (circa 1850) etched on to it. The thought was to have Colours as well etched on. As to a flag pole(s) Union Jack and Regimental pennant. They also are looking at doing an information kiosk and are looking for the uniforms of the day etc.
So any help with images and information would be of a great help.

Chris
williamcwarnick@cogeco.ca

[Jeff Mc William]

Hi (again) Chris
In command of the Reserve Battn was the senior Major of the 1st Battn. Also, another stipulation for these units was that they should be posted only to places of a temperate climate, ie; Gibraltar, the Cape of Good Hope, Australia, or New Zealand. I don't know if this was strictly adhered to but presumably they were not posted to India or Hong Kong etc.

As far as I am aware the badge would have been the same as that worn by the 1st Battn, ie for the 23rd R.W.Fus Albert shako (1844-55) as posted below. Regards. Jeff

23F Offs Albert shako plate.jpg

This is an officer's plate, I do not have a pic of the ORs, but it would have been the same except in brass and die-struck in one piece.

[highlandas]

Hi Jeff, thank you for the image.

If anyone is able and willing to scran the pages in question and send them to me, that would be great.

You drop me a note at williamcwarnick@cogeco.ca

Again than you to all who have been so helpful.

Chris

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by highlandas

Hello all,

Members of the 23rd Foot (Reserve Battalion) lost their lives on Lake Erie when the Canadian steamer Commerce sunk off the coast of Port Maitland, Ontario. My father is trying to replace the grave marker for these fine gentlemen and create a small display.

I am trying to locate images (maybe a badge) of the 23rd as they were during this period.
If any of you who are formally of the Royal Welsh Regiment or collectors of this unit have anything that may help in creating of a true representation of the Regiment during this period. Drawing of the King's Colours, uniform, etc.

My father has been in contact with the Reg. HQ Royal Welsh Regiment, however I thought I would reach out.

Chris
williamcwarnick@cogeco.ca

Although in a simplified, computer generated format, I enclose an image of the 23rd Regt's uniforms of that period (note the 'bastion' looped lace), as well as art work relating to the Crimea and a genuine, other ranks shako plate, of the type that you seek for your memorial. All of these images are in the public domain, but should be used as guides rather than for direct copying.

[highlandas]

Thank you very much! That a great start.
I knew that if there was a means to find this information, the forum was the best point to start.
Chris