Unknown 'Pouch' with brass badge

[Cribyn]

Hello

I spent some of the Xmas holidays sorting through a box of 'unknown' items and this 'pouch' is one of them.

It is brown leather, approx. 6x3" with a brass badge on the front. The badge itself is approx. 2x1.5" and has screw fixings, there are two small square nuts holding it in place. Some form of internal partition is clearly missing from the pouch itself.

I have never been very good with script, entwined initials on buttons and I just cannot work out the letters on this.

Any help would be gratefully appreciated.

I have had this for years and I will not be selling it, no matter what it is.

Many thanks
Roger

[davidwyke]

Hi Roger

My guess would be that it's a Rifle Volunteers waist belt pouch.

Can't make out what the initials are but some members are pretty good at un-scrambling cyphers/script so hopefully they will get to work on this.

The badge is very crudely cast which doesn't rule out UK but possibly Indian (or other colonial?).

David

[Cribyn]

Hi David

Thanks for the input.

Yes, the badge does seem rather crude to me but as you know I am not a badge collector, so what do I know!

The casting did seem rather Indian to me but it's those damn initials again!

Years ago I bought a button with an odd Scottish-like crest on and didn't know what it was until I got it home. On the back, instead of the usual makers/retailers backmark it said 'Calcutta Scottish'. Why can't all items be that easy to identify?

Roger

[davidwyke]

Originally Posted by Cribyn

Hi David

Years ago I bought a button with an odd Scottish-like crest on and didn't know what it was until I got it home. On the back, instead of the usual makers/retailers backmark it said 'Calcutta Scottish'. Why can't all items be that easy to identify?

Roger

If Only.......

[davidwyke]

Hi Roger

Another thought sprang to mind. I still think it's Rifle Vol connected, quite possibly Indian or at least colonial.

Another possibility though is a pouch worn by one of the various "boys organisations" which were particularly popular in the late Victorian/pre WW1 period. I'm thinking of Church Lads Brigade (although that's not what it is) and similar organisations.

Hopefully, if someone can say just what the letters are then that will provide a clue.

David

[Cribyn]

No other suggestions on this one?

Then it's back to the 'unknown' box for a few more years!

Roger

[Traist]

Hi Roger, looked long and hard, compared to all badges I have and have pictures of, but still can't make out the letters. Regards Andrew

[GriffMJ]

are you sure its brass? ..... and not a nicotine stained silver plate?

[Cribyn]

Hello Griff

I have only ever given the badge a light wash with warm water and soap and always thought it was brass. I will have another look in daylight tomorrow as you might be right.

Is there an easy way of getting nicotine staining off? Not something I have come across on buttons before!

Someone (a while ago) suggested the letters were 'BL' but I can't really see that, I think there is something more than just the two letters.

Thanks for the help,
Roger.

[GriffMJ]

Roger

Try cleaning a small patch on the back of the badge with some silvo wadding or a silver cleaner of your choosing

I clean all my badges..... "Patina" is just filth to me..... it hides markings and sometimes its true metal type.

[btns]

The letters are B.P.
Now searching for the button ...

The following buttons have script B.P. letters:
- Bechuanaland Police (KC)
- Bombay Police (KC, wreath)
- Burma Police (QVC, KC)

I am sure a 4 year old does a better job, but here is my tracing.

[GTB]

I also concur with btns that it is BP

GTB

[Alex Rice]

It could quite easily be one of the previously listed police units. I think I'm correct in saying that sometimes pouch badges didn't have a crown because the opening & closing of the flap could eventually snap the crown off.
Cheers,
Alex

[Cribyn]

Hello

First off a big 'thank you' to Griff. You were quite right! A few minutes with a silver polish and the muck started to lift off and the badge is silver after all! Just goes to show that Griff is right, a gentle wash with soap and water sometimes is just not enough! Thanks Griff!

Thanks also to btns for the drawing and suggested identification. I tried the drawing method and could get no sensible result. I was being confused by the scroll bottom right which made it look as if there was an 'L' in there somewhere.

Thanks also to GTB and to Alex for their confirmation of various points.

I now believe it is a police badge, almost certainly colonial. I have had another look at the articles written by Howard Ripley and Denis Darmanin on colonial police buttons and whilst the badge is not always the same design as the button, the button for the Burma Police seems to be the closest match.

Unless someone comes forward with a more positive ID then I will be content with this one as 'Burma Police'.

Thanks again to all who contributed to this thread.

Regards
Roger

[GriffMJ]

Where there is muck...... there is silver

Proves my point about "Patina".