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  #1  
Old 08-04-17, 11:20 AM
Cheshire Steve Cheshire Steve is offline
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Default WW1 Manchester Rgt / KLR to sort out

I have signed on here in the hope you can help me understand my grandfather's WW1 story from medals, badge/brooch, WW1 photo postcard and attestation record which suggests to me he signed up for the Manchester Regiment in 1915 though his photo postcard and medals tell me he was Corporal in the Kings Liverpool Regiment in 1918. As regards the Manchester regiment I have what I thought was a cap badge, but being solid silver may be a large brooch, and the part of his attestation which has one number crossed out and a KLR bit added with a service number thats on his medals, and then that crossed out and yet another service number written. He lived in Manchester at the time.

So is this a cap badge or a brooch? He was later in a British Legion band so wondered if he was in a regimental band and got an extra shiny badge. And what about the three different service numbers on the attestation, the last one very faint? I thought you got a number and it stayed with you.

Any help with understanding this very welcome, I am a novice at such things.
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  #2  
Old 08-04-17, 11:22 AM
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Bill A Bill A is offline
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Hello Cheshire Steve, welcome to the Forum. Your account is active and open for posts.
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  #3  
Old 08-04-17, 12:02 PM
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Regtl numbers were changed when the TF battalions were allocated new numbers circa 1916 to standardise numbers across the army.

The badge is a mufti badge worn on the lapel. Being silver it was bought commercially. They are also called sweethearts on the supposition that they were worn by wives and girlfriends.
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  #4  
Old 08-04-17, 01:08 PM
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Steve,

Arthur Richardson enlisted on 10.11.1915 in one of the service battlaions of the Manchester Regt with No. 32014.

He didnt proceed overseas to join them but remained in one of the Depot Bn.'s.

He transferred to the Kings Liverpool Regiment as no. 64453 and served overseas with the and so thats why his WW1 Pair are named to the Kings.

He later served in a Labour Coy before being transferred to the Labour |Corps as 438212.

The badge is a Hallmarked silver sweetheart badge.

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  #5  
Old 08-04-17, 02:02 PM
Cheshire Steve Cheshire Steve is offline
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Thanks very much. That is a great advance on what I previously knew. I didn't realise people jumped around between regiments and got different army numbers, probably because my father and mother always kept the same numbers throughout WW2. The 438212 was also illegible on the document I found, so that's great to know.

He certainly did have a sweetheart, and married her in 1919, so no doubt the silver brooch was hers.

So I suppose the next thing is to find with which battalion, and when, and hence where, he served with the Kings Liverpool Regiment. A photo postcard when he was away in April 1918 seems to show an all white-metal KLR cap badge, which I have read is 7th or 9th Battalion.

But you have given me a good basis to work from.

Steve
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  #6  
Old 08-04-17, 05:06 PM
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Steve ,

Can you please say exactly what is engraved on the rims of his WW1 medals ?

Thanks

P.B.
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  #7  
Old 09-04-17, 08:04 AM
Cheshire Steve Cheshire Steve is offline
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Yes, though surprised at the question as I assumed medal markings are well known.

He was awarded the British War Medal and the Victory medal and the inscription is identical on each, they both have :

64453 CPL.A.RICHARDSON L'POOL R.

He also got the Defence medal in WW2, but that isn't engraved.

Steve
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  #8  
Old 09-04-17, 09:20 AM
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Peter Brydon Peter Brydon is offline
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Steve,

Sorry to have surprised you at the question, whilst I am familiar with the markings on medals, you mentioned the 7th and 9th Kings. The numbering for the Kings Territorial battalions is shown on the attached so he was not apparently a member of a Territorial Battalion of the Kings.

There are a number of A Richardsons on The Kings Regiment data base but non of them seem to be your Grandfather.


Surname Initials First name Rank Number

RICHARDSON A ARTHUR PRIVATE 071910
RICHARDSON A ARTHUR PRIVATE 332781
RICHARDSON A ARTHUR L-CORPORAL 049238
RICHARDSON A ARTHUR PRIVATE 022232



Peter
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Last edited by Peter Brydon; 09-04-17 at 09:25 AM.
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  #9  
Old 09-04-17, 02:38 PM
Cheshire Steve Cheshire Steve is offline
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Aha ! Any help with identifying him within Kings is most welcome.

Yes, I couldn't find him at first on the website, but its because someone has mis-typed his first name when the data was entered - it is in there as ARTHUIR. Seach using surname without the Arthur, and prefix his number with a zero, and he comes up.

I would be interested to know what Battalion he was in. Is it possible to learn anything from the cap badges in this photo (dated April 1918).
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  #10  
Old 10-04-17, 09:36 AM
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Peter Brydon Peter Brydon is offline
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Steve,

The picture does not help with the battalion, it is worth contacting the Kings Regiment Curator, Karen O `Rourke to see what information they have on your Grandfather.

Alternatively the person who put the database together is a member of the Great War Forum and it might be worth asking on there.

Good luck

Peter
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  #11  
Old 10-04-17, 02:07 PM
Cheshire Steve Cheshire Steve is offline
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Found something searching one of the on-line genealogy databases, says he was 9th Labour Company KLR from 1917, and later 74th Company Labour Corps. What I now suspect is that he was a Clerk with the railways before signing up aged 21, and rail was the main way to keep the army running back then, so I suspect his role in the Manchester Regiment, then KLR, then Labour Corps was all to do with rail supplies, hence Labour company work right through the war, and his later life with LNER.

Steve
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