flaming grenades

[fez]

I have some bronze artillary flaming grenades, same as officers collars without the scroll beneath them. Can anyone tell me what they were worn on and what period ?
Thanks,
Fez

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by fez

I have some bronze artillary flaming grenades, same as officers collars without the scroll beneath them. Can anyone tell me what they were worn on and what period ?
Thanks,
Fez

It seems likely that they are collar badges from a Dominion/Colonial artillery unit. Several of these wore artillery pattern bronze collar grenades, but without the honour scroll UBIQUE, although this was later awarded to several of the units, especially after WW1.

The example image enclosed is for the Natal (South Africa) artillery and the title can be seen inscribed around the ball of the grenade.

[Peter Brydon]

According to Lichfield "The Territorial Artillery 1908-1988" page 11:

"Officers wore bronze grenades with the letter "T" below them on the lapels of service dress jackets. Initially the same as those worn by the Volunteer Artillery with no scroll below the ball of the grenade,but these were subsequently replaced by a grenade with a laurel spray on a scroll below....."

P.B.

[fez]

This is a pic of the ones i have.

[Peter Brydon]

They look like the badge illustrated in the Lichfield book mentioned above. fig. 3 on page 11.
P.B.

[Toby Purcell]

I too think that they are likely to be early TF collar grenades based upon what 8th Foot has said. They are clearly artillery 'pattern' and the explanation seems entirely logical and in accord with the practice initially adopted for TF RA cap badges.

[fez]

can you put a rough date on them ??

[Peter Brydon]

1902- 1910 (?) i.e. from when service dress was introduced until just after the formation of the Territorial Force.

P.B.

[fez]

Thank you, you are true gentlemen.
Fez

[Brian Conyngham]

Originally Posted by Toby Purcell

It seems likely that they are collar badges from a Dominion/Colonial artillery unit. Several of these wore artillery pattern bronze collar grenades, but without the honour scroll UBIQUE, although this was later awarded to several of the units, especially after WW1.

The example image enclosed is for the Natal (South Africa) artillery and the title can be seen inscribed around the ball of the grenade.

Toby

A slight correction, this "collar badge" was the standard issue South African collar and beret badge during the SADF era, many units wore it especially by National Servicemen. The Natal Field Artillery had Natal in a scroll below the badge. These can be found in chrome, darkened, bi-metal (early 1920) , brass and even gilt versions.

Regards
Brian

[54Bty]

All my SA no scroll grenade collar badges have SOUTH AFRICA - SUID AFRIKA on them.

Marc

[Brian Conyngham]

Marc

Correct, the early Dutch "note" not Afrikaans named versions however had ZUID AFRIKA SOUTH AFRICA, these are scarce these days.

When these grenades were worn as a beret badge they would be given a red felt backing (although this seems to have not always been the case) that stuck out a few millimeters but cut out in the shape of the grenade, later thin red plastic versions were introduced to get uniformity. The anti-aircraft beret badges had a red and light blue backing.

Brian

[Artynut]

Marc and Brian I show these, just to illustrate the collars mentioned. Regards, DJ......BTW, the Natal one is actually an Officer's bronze (bright light in the scanner)

[Brian Conyngham]

Guys

There is a smaller collar badge apparently worn by the SA Mounted Rifles Artillery sections that was a non-scroll and was un-named and had a smooth grenade, sorry forgot about that one!

Thanks for posting the Pictures of the plastic backings, saved me the trouble of stripping my badge board. These plastic cut-out backings can also be found on a number of other artillery badges, not only the flaming grenade type.

Brian

[Artynut]

Hi Brian, Thanks for that additional note. many of my posts seem to go unanswered and I've always thought that it was because of my location ( time difference from Zulu time.)' I too have some of the other Arty badges with the red plastic, red & blue as well as black plastic. Right now I have about 63 hat Artillery badges from your continent though to be fair they include countries such as Zambia and Zimbabwe as well as Kenya. Anything to do with the Commonwealth is fair game! best regards, David J.