WANTED - WWII S.A.S. cap badge

In my tarnished rubished opinion as a collector and highly regarded maker of copy badges for over 30 years IT AINT WAS IT SAYS IT IS. On here we all have our opinions or are we not allowed? It has to turn into some kind of 'What I say goes' closed shop?

[Jack8]

Originally Posted by Hanbut

Still not a WW2 wing,

It is in my opinion.

What makes you think it is not?

Jack

[rhodesianmilitaria]

Originally Posted by Hanbut

In my tarnished rubished opinion as a collector and highly regarded maker of copy badges for over 30 years IT AINT WAS IT SAYS IT IS. On here we all have our opinions or are we not allowed? It has to turn into some kind of 'What I say goes' closed shop?

So your opinion is it isn't. No reason. No facts. Just that it isn't a WWII SAS wing and this from a person who for over two decades sold fakes as genuine.

[johanwiegman]

Originally Posted by Hanbut

Many thanks for the superb help. BTW did anyone else spot this. I am convinced this IS NOT 1944 pattern
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SAS-WWII-194...p2047675.l2557
Bit naughty as he is very knowledgeable on SAS insignia

Friends,

I believe that wing is an early fifties variant of the 1944 pattern. There are subtle differences to the 1944 pattern. One difference is the thicker thread of the embroidery and the thicker rigging lines. The pattern is actually quite rare, more so than the classic 1944 as it was made in much smaller numbers. A very nice wing indeed!

Cheers,

Johan

[Eddie Parks]

God this SAS malarky is so boring!!! How about we all make a belated New Year's Resolution never to mention them again in 2016?

Eddie

[JON188]

We could always just crack on with the Lions of Messopatamia ;-)
Did I send you the photo of the badge being worn mate?
Rather than hijack this thread PM me your email address mate
Regards
Jon

The wing was a nice one I was almost tempted to buy and copy them but post WW2 copies do not really sell as well as the WW2 ones. Everybody knows I sell good copy insignia and also have a large amount or Original is my shop.
How about a New Years resolution stop dishing the dirt on 20 year old claims and start loving each other
Peace and Goodwill to all men or is that old hat now it is January.

What many of these old timer collectors don't realise is without the copies filling a very large market place most of them could not afford an infantry cap badge because there would be so many collectors chasing the at the moment common stuff.

Lets use this Forum to educate the newbies and even older collectors instead of the constant mudslinging. A? Wishing everyone a Happy and definitely Prosperous New Year. Andrew

[johanwiegman]

Attachment 139043

Originally Posted by johanwiegman

Friends,

I believe that wing is an early fifties variant of the 1944 pattern. There are subtle differences to the 1944 pattern. One difference is the thicker thread of the embroidery and the thicker rigging lines. The pattern is actually quite rare, more so than the classic 1944 as it was made in much smaller numbers. A very nice wing indeed!

Cheers,

Johan

Friends,

See the two wing patterns compared. The 1944 pattern in this case was worn during Malaya period with press studs, but still very much a 1944 pattern wing.

The fifties variant has very different, thicker embroidery and stitching.

Cheers,

Johan

[rhodesianmilitaria]

Originally Posted by Hanbut

The wing was a nice one I was almost tempted to buy and copy them but post WW2 copies do not really sell as well as the WW2 ones. Everybody knows I sell good copy insignia and also have a large amount or Original is my shop.
How about a New Years resolution stop dishing the dirt on 20 year old claims and start loving each other
Peace and Goodwill to all men or is that old hat now it is January.

What many of these old timer collectors don't realise is without the copies filling a very large market place most of them could not afford an infantry cap badge because there would be so many collectors chasing the at the moment common stuff.

Lets use this Forum to educate the newbies and even older collectors instead of the constant mudslinging. A? Wishing everyone a Happy and definitely Prosperous New Year. Andrew

You're a liar Andrew and anybody who has known you for a while knows that. You listed many things over the years as genuine when you knew they were fakes. This was one of them.

ca6f_1.JPG

I'm amazed the owner of this forum allows you to be a member.

I have been to The Father and confessed my sins and said my Hail Mary's. In the eyes of the Lord have been forgiven. I do understand you and certain minorities that 'THANK' you that is not enough. I am the dregs of the earth because I make copy badges and sell to people that want them. I have never forced people to buy them I offer them quality made pieces at a reasonable price and spend my money on militaria that is why I enjoy this forum because sometimes I can part my humble opinion onto others. Spread the word our good lord said. Andrew

[Cribyn]

Hello Hanbut

You said "I am the dregs of the earth because I make copy badges and sell to people that want them".

Might I suggest that those people who do think you are the dregs of the earth (and other retailers like you, as you are not alone) do not think so because you make copies and meet an obvious demand but because those copies are not marked as such and are often made in the full knowledge that they are, at some point in the future, going to be passed off as originals.

In a recent thread on this Forum you mentioned an early production 'copy' badge of yours being 'aged' and passed off as genuine. There must be an awful lot of unsuspecting people out there who have been taken in by these aged badges of yours and parted with a lot of their hard earned cash.

I do not collect badges and one reason is that there are so many copies produced by people like you that are now being passed off as originals.
Whether you have repented or not, some of the responsibility must rest on your shoulders.

Regards
Roger

[pontecagnano]

Originally Posted by Hanbut

I am totally confused now, I just thought it was a manufacturers variation, so can anyone confirm these are 21st badges or now late WW2 beret badges

I believe the bottom left and bottom right badges are uncut NZSAS OR's beret badges. A quick way to identify these is that the cross guard of Excalibur doesn't have red embroidery on the bottom horizontal line. There are other consistent indicators too:

1) the shape of the scroll
2)The scroll is close to the flames (but not touching) and the right hand flame is further away from the scroll than the left hand one.
3) the black lines up the middle of the flames disappear off the edge of the badge rather than stopping short.

I have attached some uncut examples to illustrate this. The cut example (note lack of centring) appears to be another example of the bottom right badge in Andrew's selection.

These uncut NZSAS beret badges are sometimes erroneously sold as 21 SAS arm badges, and, on one occasion, I saw one advertised as a Zimbabwean SAS beret badge!

More recent NZSAS beret badges (pre-shaped rather than cut to shape) seem to have the second red line, as do officers' bullion badges.

Regards,

Graham

[WWIIBuff]

Wow I guess I really opened a can of worms with my "Wanted" post. I did not realize these badges were such a minefield.

[airtrooper]

Did you end up getting one after all ?
I MAY be able to assist.

[WWIIBuff]

No, not yet, still looking.

I am also looking for an early set of WWII S.A.S. wings.