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  #16  
Old 06-02-21, 04:13 PM
Buzz Buzz is offline
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Originally Posted by CB101 View Post
Could it by any chance be something simple like two casualties who both had the same name?

Be worth looking at the Commonwealth War Graves Commission site and checking that possibly out
Only one casualty with my relatives name.
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  #17  
Old 06-02-21, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Alex Rice View Post
The practice of putting together fake groups of medals which are excellent groups is disgusting. The British Medals Forum might be able to assist with the way forward or possibly you could also get advice from auction houses such as Dix Noonan Webb for advice.
Cheers,
Alex
Thanks Alex
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  #18  
Old 06-02-21, 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by altcar73 View Post
If there are any offences disclosed, it would be for the person who parted with cash and who bought the (dodgy?) medals to make the complaint. If anyone was duped it was that person. Not you. Ideally, you need to make contact with that person, if you can track him down. He should then take his complaint to the appropriate trading standards dept. I would not even attempt to get the police involved. They would simply point you (or him) in the direction of trading standards.

Dave.
Thanks Dave, surely the act of making up fake documents to accompany war medals in order to pass them off as something they are not is fraudulent regardless of who the injured party is. If I get no success through the auction house I will go to trading standards. The auction house will have records as to who put the items into the auction. I know that the lot was originally put into the auction house initially in May last year in a different format in that there was an extra medal in the set. That lot was withdrawn for whatever reason. When it was put back into the auction in the November it was a three medal lot. Very strange!
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  #19  
Old 06-02-21, 05:09 PM
altcar73 altcar73 is offline
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I don't want to sound negative, but you are probably going to have great difficulty in getting anyone to take any meaningful action. The auction house will not tell you anything. They may offer to forward any correspondence from you to the seller/buyer, but I doubt it. In effect, if they did so, they will be engineering a problem for themselves. The buyer may then tell the auction house that he wants his money back and the seller is likely to ignore you altogether!

You say that the medals have changed hands a couple of times. This in itself complicates matters further.

As others have said, this practice does go on. Its not right, but its difficult to stop. You may regard it as a point of principle to chase it. But, I fear you may die in a ditch doing so.

Dave.
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  #20  
Old 06-02-21, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by altcar73 View Post
I don't want to sound negative, but you are probably going to have great difficulty in getting anyone to take any meaningful action. The auction house will not tell you anything. They may offer to forward any correspondence from you to the seller/buyer, but I doubt it. In effect, if they did so, they will be engineering a problem for themselves. The buyer may then tell the auction house that he wants his money back and the seller is likely to ignore you altogether!

You say that the medals have changed hands a couple of times. This in itself complicates matters further.

As others have said, this practice does go on. Its not right, but its difficult to stop. You may regard it as a point of principle to chase it. But, I fear you may die in a ditch doing so.

Dave.
Thanks Dave. Yes you are probably right. But I am going to give it a go. I have to try. Allowing this sort of thing to happen just doesn't sit right with me. It is so disrespectful. To quote from a famous movie "but what I do have are a very particular set of skills. Skills I have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make me a nightmare for people like you"
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  #21  
Old 06-02-21, 06:03 PM
altcar73 altcar73 is offline
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Well said! Best of luck.

Dave.
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  #22  
Old 06-02-21, 08:54 PM
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yorkstone yorkstone is offline
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Buzz,
It may be the box is the original item! and items have them been added to that add original generic documents a realistic faked slip and there you are one authentic casualty group. This has been going on for years sadly.
Regards
Stephen
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  #23  
Old 07-02-21, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by yorkstone View Post
Buzz,
It may be the box is the original item! and items have them been added to that add original generic documents a realistic faked slip and there you are one authentic casualty group. This has been going on for years sadly.
Regards
Stephen
Hi Stephen. It has to be a fake box as it bears an address which although it exists has no connection with the family. I have made enquiries and no one bearing the name on the box has ever lived at that address.
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  #24  
Old 07-02-21, 05:14 PM
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Buzz,

Please keep us posted.

Chris
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  #25  
Old 07-02-21, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by CAM View Post
Buzz,

Please keep us posted.

Chris
Will do Chris. I intend to post photos of the medals and related documentation of these items as they have gone through the auction/selling chain at the conclusion of my investigations. I think it will be interesting for people to see what has been presented at the various stages. It will be interesting to get people's thoughts.
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  #26  
Old 08-02-21, 06:04 AM
Alex Rice Alex Rice is offline
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Thanks Buzz. I would be very interested to see how you progress.
Cheers,
Alex
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  #27  
Old 08-02-21, 04:38 PM
Dave67 Dave67 is offline
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I think it is absolutely disgusting that people can put fake groups together with faked documentation.
That is an absolute insult to those that fought for them.
I find it even more disgusting as a serving member of the forces who has several campaign medals.
These people ought to be jailed.
Sorry just my thoughts
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  #28  
Old 08-02-21, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave67 View Post
I think it is absolutely disgusting that people can put fake groups together with faked documentation.
That is an absolute insult to those that fought for them.
I find it even more disgusting as a serving member of the forces who has several campaign medals.
These people ought to be jailed.
Sorry just my thoughts
Well said Dave. Totally agree.
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  #29  
Old 08-02-21, 07:48 PM
mm1 mm1 is online now
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Dave, it's been going on for a long time. One of the reasons I moved from medals to badges - not knowing that faking was just as much as a problem with badges !

As I stated earlier in this post, it is relatively easy to make up a set of WW2 medals including paperwork.It's a bit harder with WW1 groups as the paperwork is usually more detailed.You can get fake death plaques, fake named boxes, faked and aged paperwork and medals can be re-named.A real nightmare for collectors as, for an example, a re-named military medal,military cross or DCM group can be upwards of £1,000.Throw into that mix an original medal that is a replacement for a lost medal and the 'R' for replacement has been carefully removed....

Mark
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