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  #1  
Old 11-01-13, 01:52 PM
ORISKANY ORISKANY is offline
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Unhappy MORE IMPORTS FOR THE ARMED FORCES

It has just been announced that the MOD are buying pistols to replace the Browning, from Austria. What a shame we cannot compete to provide work for our own country. Bleak times ahead indeed.

Another blow to add to the uniforms from China, vehicles from Germany and goodness knows what else.

Don't tell me, I know it is all cash driven!
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  #2  
Old 11-01-13, 03:56 PM
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Personally - and I know I am not qualified to comment on this - I'm glad British soldiers are not given any old crap, just because it is produced in the UK... That would be very bad logic indeed. Snatch Land Rover anyone?

I'd also remind you that there's nothing new about it either. The SLR was Belgian in patent, and I imagine FN made a packet out of it, even if it was assembled in the UK. The same could be said of many other pieces of kit, right back to the US lend-lease tanks of WWII and beyond.
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Old 11-01-13, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brigade Piron View Post
Personally - and I know I am not qualified to comment on this - I'm glad British soldiers are not given any old crap, just because it is produced in the UK... That would be very bad logic indeed. Snatch Land Rover anyone?

I'd also remind you that there's nothing new about it either. The SLR was Belgian in patent, and I imagine FN made a packet out of it, even if it was assembled in the UK. The same could be said of many other pieces of kit, right back to the US lend-lease tanks of WWII and beyond.
I am not suggesting that the British Armed forces should be given 'any old crap just because it is produced in the UK'. The finest Armed Forces in the world bar none deserve the best. I understand that snatch Land Rover was basically a good vehicle but deployed in the wrong environment. My underlying gripe is that we have millions unemployed and many more under employed here in UK. Paying people who are out of work, not through their own fault, and giving contracts to Johnny foreigner is the bad logic. More r and d in industry and a suitably trained workforce is the answer, so that we can produce kit for our own forces without having to rely on outsiders.
Lend-lease is a red herring, this was needed when our US allies had the opportunity to help us in time of a world war when UK was at full stretch to produce its own. I regret that we are now a nation of retail outlets and coffee shops, all selling, in the main imported junk from abroad. A late note. I have just heard about 800 jobs lost at Honda in Swindon.
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Old 11-01-13, 05:45 PM
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LONGSHANKS LONGSHANKS is offline
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I agree to some extent that home produced military material would be preferable. If it;s boots and uniforms then I imagine price talks. But take for example, that over here in the US, I believe nearly 50% of the chips and computer components are made in Asia.......b I imagine we British are doing the same. As I said, low hanging fruit like boots to save a Buck etc are OK if you have to, but strategic components is insane.

Simon.
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Old 11-01-13, 05:53 PM
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LONGSHANKS LONGSHANKS is offline
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Oh, one other note. Don't forget Browning was an American gun. The last pistol we made for the fighting Brit was the Webley. Powerful weapon, but out of date by WW1.
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  #6  
Old 11-01-13, 07:15 PM
2747andy 2747andy is offline
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Guys,
can we stop being political and please stick to badges and insignia...

As a serving soldier I can assure you that we now have some of the best equipment and weapon system in the world, regardless of who makes them!

Badges please and please, please, please stop having a cheap snipe at those who are serving about how they wear or use this equipment!

If you are no longer serving, then IMO you are out of date and shoud stick to what you knew when you were!

Have a good weekend!

Andy
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Old 11-01-13, 07:15 PM
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Oriskany, I personally think that Britain is getting worse and worse. Our industry has gone down hill. Our Armed Forces are shrinking, and we let anyone come across our borders. It's a no wonder we can't provide our own equipment to our own forces. We are either to crap or to expensive. It' s just as we'll the Americans are our side.
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Old 11-01-13, 09:14 PM
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These Glock's are lighter and hold more rounds - 17 v 13 for the Browning - those 4 rounds could save your life in a tight spot?

And is Browning not a US company anyway?


The real tragedy is that we are not in the running with a UK manufactured pistol to out perform them all considering our history, but then all our manufacturing has been shipped overseas.
'Sheffield steel' never heard mentioned any more - mining and shipbuilding - gone -ICI Chemicals had plants the size of large towns- gone; and it goes on and on and on. We have the financial wizards in the City of London though. God help us.

[rant over ]
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Old 11-01-13, 09:47 PM
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LONGSHANKS LONGSHANKS is offline
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Maybe the UK should request statehood and become the 51st....they have more than enough weapons to supply. Hey, we 300 million gun's in public hands over here.....

Simon
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  #10  
Old 11-01-13, 10:58 PM
ORISKANY ORISKANY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2747andy View Post
Guys,
can we stop being political and please stick to badges and insignia...

As a serving soldier I can assure you that we now have some of the best equipment and weapon system in the world, regardless of who makes them!

Badges please and please, please, please stop having a cheap snipe at those who are serving about how they wear or use this equipment!

If you are no longer serving, then IMO you are out of date and shoud stick to what you knew when you were!

Have a good weekend!

Andy
Andy,

This section of the Forum is for 'Everything else>Other Military topics.'

As a former Serviceman I am only too pleased to hear that the Army has the best equipment and weapons systems in the world. MY remarks are NOT pointed at Serving members of the Armed Forces but the system of supply that has somehow side stepped home produced clothing and equipment. I would prefer to see our Armed Forces wearing kit produced in Canton, Cardiff than Canton, China and likewise other things like home produced vehicles and weapons. We are victims of world trade and therefore must accept the consequences.

I do not see any cheap snipes at those serving or how they wear or use their equipment. I accept that I have posted remarks regarding berets and their appearance. I am sure that if these were considered inappropriate they would have been removed.

There is a lot of space for badges etc and that is only right on a badge forum. I am sure that if any posts were in the wrong section they would be moved by a moderator. Please be aware that all Forum members serving and civilian have equal rights to post their views and legitimate comments.

Have you forgotten that you yourself posted a derogatory term about a serving RSM under the Small Arms School Corps thread.? I quote, He just looks like a Tw.t!!

Oriskany.
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  #11  
Old 11-01-13, 11:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brigade Piron View Post
The SLR was Belgian in patent, and I imagine FN made a packet out of it, even if it was assembled in the UK. The same could be said of many other pieces of kit, right back to the US lend-lease tanks of WWII and beyond.
UK SLR's were 'inch' versions of the FN Rifle with modifications and were licenced built with UK componant mainly by the Royal Small Arms Factory Enfield, who also produced the SA80 untill BAE sold out to H&K

Quote:
Originally Posted by LONGSHANKS View Post
Oh, one other note. Don't forget Browning was an American gun. The last pistol we made for the fighting Brit was the Webley. Powerful weapon, but out of date by WW1.
FN Herstal (Belgium) acquired the Browning Arms Company which had been established in 1927, and produced the bulk of the UK Browning 9mm pistols. The .380" Webley served on till 1960 by the way
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  #12  
Old 12-01-13, 12:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_2817 View Post
UK SLR's were 'inch' versions of the FN Rifle with modifications and were licenced built with UK componant mainly by the Royal Small Arms Factory Enfield, who also produced the SA80 untill BAE sold out to H&K



FN Herstal (Belgium) acquired the Browning Arms Company which had been established in 1927, and produced the bulk of the UK Browning 9mm pistols. The .380" Webley served on till 1960 by the way
Hi Mike, just wanted to point out I didn't say the Webley stopped production after WW1 just that it was out of date by then. And also I never said the Browning was made in America that we used (although the early one's were), but pointed out that it wasn't British.

Cheers

Simon.
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  #13  
Old 12-01-13, 01:45 AM
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AFAIK, we no longer used the Browning anyway I thought we'd gone over to the SIG SAUER P226????

Tom
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Old 12-01-13, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
giving contracts to Johnny foreigner is the bad logic
Yet we benefit when "Johnny foreigner" buys from BAE? No country in the world does, or should, get all its kit from one country. If a British firm made kit of a suitable quality competitively, then that would be great and they could compete like anyone else.

There are much cheaper ways of subsidising domestic industry which don't have the same potentially disastrous consequences.
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Old 12-01-13, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LONGSHANKS View Post
Hi Mike, just wanted to point out I didn't say the Webley stopped production after WW1 just that it was out of date by then. And also I never said the Browning was made in America that we used (although the early one's were), but pointed out that it wasn't British.

Cheers

Simon.
The .38" Webley and revolvers in general were still very much a currant design at the outbreak and during WWII, I think you mean the Webley .445" Revolver which was the main WWI revolver!

Early Issue Mk1 9mm Browning were manufactured by Inglis of Canada in 1944 as the US Forces mainly used the Browning 1911 .45" model.
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