Bronze officer’s cap badge finish

[Charlie585]

Hi Dave,

A good point and your experience of these badges is far greater than mine.

Several factors to consider with Bronzed badges then:

1. The base metal.

2. The solution and its method of application and fixing, which seems to differ between manufactures.

3. Regimental preference/practice.

4. Age, and wear and tear.

Ry

[davec2]

That's just about it Ry,

I think there is one more point worth mentioning !

I for one, do not know how the manufacturers achieved their different finishes over a hundred years ago, the finishes could even be done using powder coating and heat, I don't know but what-ever was done it goes some way to explaining why it is so difficult to replicate some of the original colours ??

Dave.

[norfolk regt man]

on repairs I use the same stuff as used by the older badge makers, but at £300 per litre, you want to know what your doing with it.

I cant buy less than a litre at the moment.

[Peter Brydon]

Interestingly ( to me at least ) this is what it says in "The Staffords 1881-1978" by Rosignoli and Whitehouse.

P.B.

[Charlie585]

Originally Posted by norfolk regt man

on repairs I use the same stuff as used by the older badge makers, but at £300 per litre, you want to know what your doing with it.

I cant buy less than a litre at the moment.

Intriguing Andrew, I'm sure we would all be interested in hearing more about this product?

Originally Posted by 8thfoot

Interestingly ( to me at least ) this is what it says in "The Staffords 1881-1978" by Rosignoli and Whitehouse.

P.B.

Also of interest Peter,

I suppose we should assume then that if the badges were painted that the paint may have been lead based. It might be wise to apply caution when carrying out repairs or even just handling some OSD badges!

Ry

[davec2]

Originally Posted by 8thfoot

Interestingly ( to me at least ) this is what it says in "The Staffords 1881-1978" by Rosignoli and Whitehouse.

P.B.

Cheers Peter,

Well done that man.

That is interesting, it helps to clarify why the finishes were so diverse, I am sure I have mentioned in the past that some badges appeared to be painted, it helps to vindicate my opinions as well, perhaps even with the powder coating method ??

Dave.

[badger123]

Originally Posted by davec2

Cheers Peter,

Well done that man.

That is interesting, it helps to clarify why the finishes were so diverse, I am sure I have mentioned in the past that some badges appeared to be painted, it helps to vindicate my opinions as well, perhaps even with the powder coating method ??

Dave.

I agree Dave. a very interesting thread that answers some questions for me too. It also may explain this badge (an OR's badge painted/coloured as an OSD) which I showed you some time ago.

Ivan

[magpie]

You may find the original bronze solution was made up by the badge manufacturer's using a recipe of toxic chemicals and prosces it's use of which was discontinued in the 50's I believe.
Andy.

[Peter Brydon]

Ivan,

I think it has been mentioned before that it is was not unknown for newly commissioned Home Guard officers in WW2 to simply paint their existing cap badges bronze, one reason why you might come across bronze painted OR`s badges.

Peter

[badger123]

Peter,

No, I wasn't aware of that but its certainly a plausible reason for a WW1 badge being bronzed. Do you have a reference for this or know where it was mentioned?

Many thanks, Ivan

[Peter Brydon]

Ivan,

Sorry I didn't realise that was a WW1 badge.

The late Tim Ashley had a Kings badged F.S. cap which he got directly from the officer himself, who had painted the existing OR`s badge bronze on being commissioned when a member of the Home Guard.

Peter

P.S.

There was also the fact that in Gallipoli ( May 1915 -Jan 1916 ) badges were blackened with burnt rope and Creosote ( letter date 14/7/1958 to Professor Charles Thomas from H.Y.Usher, who had himself been in Gallipoli ) I do wonder what actual colour finish that would have put on the badges or indeed what the finish might have faded to over time.

There is also a note in the Eric Dickinson Archive which I have on the dress of the Liverpool Scottish which says "Battalion orders for 14th June 1915 state that " Ornaments-cap badges should be either blackened or removed, no evidence of blackened badges has been found but there is plenty for the removal of bonnet badges"

I assume the order came from a higher level and there is a suppose a possibility that some battalions on the Western Front blackened their badges and again depending what was used to achieve a black finish , who knows the shade that the badges might have ended up with.

[Hussar100]

During Op Banner the black finish on many badges was just applied by a spray can.

There are also occasions when a worn or faded finish is desirable, particularly on officer's bullion badges because it shows longevity of service. This apparent snobbery isn't confined to badges either. Soldiers in general have this attitude to most items of work uniform. Nobody wants to look like a sprog so worn, faded, scratched uniform is desirable. I've yet to see a colonel or CO order anyone in work uniform to change badges or uniform items because they show signs of wear.

Different in No2, No1, No14, or ceremonial dress. They've always to look pristine - in my experience.

[2747andy]

Originally Posted by badger123

Peter,

No, I wasn't aware of that but its certainly a plausible reason for a WW1 badge being bronzed. Do you have a reference for this or know where it was mentioned?

Many thanks, Ivan

Ivan,
I'm pretty sure there's a strong chance that your chocolate coloured badge started life adorning the head-dress of an other rank (OR)? Commissioned OR's would not have the funds of their more wealthy mess members, or would they have the chance to pop to Blightly to purchase one from their "Gentlemen's Outfitters"! lol

I've come across several, mostly Corps OR's badges that have been painted brown, probably in theater and to be honest even with the closest scrutiny pass the "Eye Test" when viewed from the front!

Andy

[badger123]

Yes Andy another plausible reason for this badge and I like the thought of a commissioned OR having his badge turned into an OSD.

The bronzing colouring is very good and I just wonder how would this have been done (bearing in mind that tins of spray paint weren't available in those days).

Ivan

[Phil2M]

Just recently got this badge, a qc gm RF cap badge, it appears to be an example of the painted variety, all be it a modern one.

I also have a bronzed, o/r, Leicestershire tiger thats been chemically bronzed, clearly of the period.