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  #1  
Old 24-10-19, 04:45 PM
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Default Admiralty Police buttons

Can anyone knowledgeable kindly describe the pattern of button/s worn by the former Admiralty Civil Police as well as the Metropolitan Civil Police in HM Dockyards. Would they have been generic 'Police Force' types? An accompanying time frame would be most welcome.

GTB
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  #2  
Old 24-10-19, 09:29 PM
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The Met. Police in the Dockyards wore the same tunic buttons as those serving in the Metropolitan Police District.

The Admiralty Civil Police wore buttons bearing the Crown above an anchor in white metal.

Dave.
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  #3  
Old 25-10-19, 08:55 AM
bobanodised bobanodised is offline
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Smile Admiralty police

E......y
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  #4  
Old 25-10-19, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobanodised View Post
E......y
Thanks Dave and bobanodised, although cannot interpret E......y!

I am trying to make heads or tails with my Malta Dockyard Police/Admiralty Constabulary items and am reaching the conclusion that there is a variance between UK and Malta organisations, although both were Crown organisations.
Post-Victorian period buttons used in Malta were the KC in annulus inscribed DOCKYARD POLICE, followed by KC surmounting anchor (which I suppose should represent Adm Constab) followed by a QC version, and culminating with ERII representing MoD Police. However, the latter organisation wasn't used here and the cypher buttons were worn by Adm Constab post 1971.

Upon consulting an MoD chart I find there is variance concerning dates of use which has me running around in circles. Will get there eventually

GTB
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  #5  
Old 25-10-19, 11:47 AM
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Ebay, its an ebay listing photo.
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"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts."
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  #6  
Old 25-10-19, 12:22 PM
altcar73 altcar73 is offline
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Why is it that so many people on this forum don't like using the word eBay? Its quite easy to spell! Or perhaps they would rather puzzle readers and have them scratching their heads, such as the gent starting this thread. Its almost as bad as the bewildering abbreviations that are continually used by certain individuals. Rant over.

Dave.

Last edited by altcar73; 25-10-19 at 02:33 PM.
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  #7  
Old 25-10-19, 12:46 PM
bobanodised bobanodised is offline
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Default E....y

It’s an auction site we have here in England


I’m such a a malteaser 😉
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  #8  
Old 25-10-19, 02:58 PM
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The attached should give a chronology of the units/nomenclatures involved.

I am unsure if the QC Adm Constab was actually utilised. Need to check further.
The Metropolitan button is inserted to verify if such was the button utilised in UK.
The Malta Dockyard Police constables cap and collar badges followed the pattern of the Met Civil Police (Thames Div)
Local old timers still in employ are known to have continued to wear the QVC button shown as well as Victorian crown badges. KC insignia would be issued as normal to new recruits

GTB
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  #9  
Old 25-10-19, 04:33 PM
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My spanner in the works is that I have recently seen Admiralty Civil Police buttons in an old collection on the internet. They were chrome R.N. Petty Officers' buttons both KC and QC.

I had the plain, no rim, KC/QC over foul anchor as Admiralty Constabulary.
Wikipedia has an article on this force:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Admiralty_Constabulary
The force is now known as Ministry of Defence Police

Wikipedia has this on the Royal Navy Police:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Navy_Police
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  #10  
Old 25-10-19, 05:47 PM
altcar73 altcar73 is offline
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The KC/Anchor buttons as illustrated by the starter of this thread were worn by the Admiralty Civil Police and the Admiralty Constabulary. There is no difference between the two.

Dave.
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  #11  
Old 30-10-19, 05:08 PM
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Default Admiralty Police buttons

What Dave said is absolutely right - the Admiralty Civil Police and the Admiralty Constabulary wore exactly the same button (the one shown earler in the thread). There is no difference between them at all.

Re the buttons that btns referred to. I have been trying to identify the origins of the white-metal RN ratings-type buttons I have in my own collection for many years. I have both King's and Queen's Crown buttons and even anodised examples. I have never been able to discover who used them but it can't have been the Admiralty Civil Police as they would never have had Queen's Crown buttons. They were absobed into the Admiralty Constabulary upon its establishment in the late-1940s and ceased to exist from that point.

Finally re the buttons worn by members of the Dockyard Division of the Metropolitan Police. As stated, they were the standard Metropolitan Police button and were the same as worn by all other members of the Metropolitan Police. I have examples with both the VQC and the KC in my own collection. Of course I have no idea if my buttons were worn by a constable patrolling Devonport Dockyard or Bow Street (nor any way of telling) but they do provide continuity in my collection of Dockyard Police buttons.

However it is worth pointing out that at about the same time as the Metropolitan Police were leaving the dockyards, the Met decided to slightly change the design of its buttons. So be aware that only the earlier design of King's Crown Metropolitan Police button might have been worn by members of the Dockyard Division.

I will post some images to show the difference.

Pete
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  #12  
Old 31-10-19, 10:29 AM
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Default Admiralty Police buttons

Here are three images of Metropolitan Police buttons.

The VQC and the first KC example are the patterns that would have been worn by Metropolitan Police officers serving in the Dockyards. Both patterns existed in white-metal and black (initially horn but later bakelite). The black buttons were, I believe, worn on night uniforms. As can be seen, the title 'Metropolitan Police' is shown on a garter.

The third button shows the KC pattern button adopted after the Metropolitan Police had left the dockyards. In this case the title 'Metropolitan Police' is shown on a circlet.

A final point that I forgot to mention earlier. QC Admiralty Constabulary buttons were certainly used in the UK, although I'm not sure about whether they were issued in Malta - although I would have expected them to have been if the King's Crown pattern buttons were used.

Pete

Last edited by Guzzman; 31-10-19 at 10:37 AM.
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  #13  
Old 01-11-19, 05:14 PM
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Re Malta use. There was quite a bit of leeway in the wearing of insignia By the Dockyard Police/Admiralty Constab.
From my notes and personal experience, I can confirm that QVC Dockyard buttons and collar crowns were worn long after Victoria's reign. The Adm Constab KC buttons were worn in QE Elizabeth's reign, together with KC cap and collar badges. The cypher buttons used by MOD Police were also introduced but the Adm Constab nomenclature and badges were retained up to disbandment in 1979
Interesting research

GTB
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