British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

Recent Books by Forum Members

   

Go Back   British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum > British Military Insignia > Infantry (& Guards) Badges

 Other Pages: Galleries, Links etc.
Glossary  Books by Forum Members     Canadian Pre 1914    CEF    CEF Badge Inscriptions   Canadian post 1920     Canadian post 1953     British Cavalry Badges     Makers' Marks    Pipers' Badges  Canadian Cloth Titles  Books  SEARCH
 
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #46  
Old 10-05-21, 04:11 PM
manchesters's Avatar
manchesters manchesters is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 6,359
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by manchesters View Post
Hello,

Anyone who is a dealer and sends you that amount of blatent fakes should NOT have a decent reputation.

I think he is taking advantage of your limited knowledge and I would send the lot back to be honest.

regards
You are being ripped off in my opinion, but the choice is yours. My advice is clear. We are here to help you hence the advice.

I will say no more on the matter.

regards
__________________
Simon Butterworth

Manchester Regiment Collector
Rank, Prize & Trade Badges
British & Commonwealth Artillery Badges
  #47  
Old 10-05-21, 04:17 PM
kaiserwilhelm2 kaiserwilhelm2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by manchesters View Post
You are being ripped off in my opinion, but the choice is yours. My advice is clear. We are here to help you hence the advice.

I will say no more on the matter.

regards
Thank you Simon - advice appreciated!
  #48  
Old 10-05-21, 04:53 PM
Jelly Terror's Avatar
Jelly Terror Jelly Terror is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 2,081
Default

There are many so-called 'reputable' dealers who are most definitely not above knowingly flogging dicey badges. The lamb in post #41 was bought from a very well-known and highly respected dealer, and was being sold as 'genuine'.

Did he know it was a fake but sold it as a good badge anyway, or did he have no idea it was a fake and was therefore not as erudite and well-informed as the collecting community have us believe?
  #49  
Old 10-05-21, 05:40 PM
grenadierguardsman's Avatar
grenadierguardsman grenadierguardsman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 3,281
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaiserwilhelm2 View Post
Dear Luke,

Thanks for your post. I am not sure why given the circumstances (which are those?) you do not feel like vetting any more. Of course you are completely free to help me out or not. However reading what you wrote I get the feeling like I am somehow doing something wrong which I am pretty sure I have not done. I checked on the forum if the seller had anything bad written about him and I did not see anything of the sort. He was mentioned several times on the forum as a source for badges and participating in various fairs. So I contacted him told him I was looking for original ww1-era and ww2-era badges and selected these which were on his website and asked him again if these were genuine and correct for the period which he said these were. I then discussed with him returns and he agreed to take back any and all badges without any problems within four weeks after I received these for inspection. I told him I would have these checked out. Then I turned to the forum to get help. I am not sure if people would have responded more possitively if I had posted two hunderd or more links on this forum with the question is this badge ok and only then order it. I fear people would have been turned off by that approach.

As for returning the whole batch - how does that help me? I and others, including you, on the forum have put quite a bit of time into this and so far this has turned up 20 or so fakes which is of course not great when looking at what the seller told me but on the other hand the great majority (at the moment about 90% or more still appears to be genuine). I am not helped by returning the good badges and having to start the whole process again with possibly a similar outcome unless of course someone can refer me to a dealer which without exception sells genuine pieces for reasonable prices.

As for naming the seller I am hesitant to do so as I still need his cooperation in getting my money returned for fake badges and as such am not in a possition to name and shame. I hope you understand this and you and others will continue to help me out as I am just trying to build up a fake free collection of these beautiful badges and with it honour the British Army for its part in liberating us in occupied Europe from the Germans. IMO nothing wrong with that. If you see things differently feel free to let me know. I will also send this post in a pm to you. In any case thank you and others for your help so far.

Cheers, Tom
By not naming the dealer, you are allowing others to buy from him/her.
Andy
__________________
Leave to carry on Sir please.
  #50  
Old 10-05-21, 05:49 PM
kaiserwilhelm2 kaiserwilhelm2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman View Post
By not naming the dealer, you are allowing others to buy from him/her.
Andy
Please understand that I have not concluded my business with the dealer as I am still dependent on him returning payment for the fake badges. Please some understanding for my situation.
  #51  
Old 10-05-21, 06:30 PM
Hoot Hoot is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 1,359
Default

Tom, try asking the dealer why there is a four week limit on returns. If he is as straight as you appear to think he is then I see no reason why he would shackle you. It would seem you are being railroaded into this deal.
  #52  
Old 10-05-21, 06:54 PM
kaiserwilhelm2 kaiserwilhelm2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoot View Post
Tom, try asking the dealer why there is a four week limit on returns. If he is as straight as you appear to think he is then I see no reason why he would shackle you. It would seem you are being railroaded into this deal.
Thanks for your post. Actually there is only a one week return but before buying the badges I asked for a four week inspection period which at the time seemed sufficient. Now one week into the four week inspection period a little over 50% of the posted badges have been given opinions on. So half the vetting has now been done. If people keep extending their help as they have been doing so far - shout out to you for giving such great assistance - hopefully those badges not yet vetted will have been done as well and I will know which to return and which to keep. Please keep up the good work! THANK YOU!
  #53  
Old 10-05-21, 07:12 PM
Hoot Hoot is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 1,359
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaiserwilhelm2 View Post
Thanks for your post. Actually there is only a one week return but before buying the badges I asked for a four week inspection period which at the time seemed sufficient. Now one week into the four week inspection period a little over 50% of the posted badges have been given opinions on. So half the vetting has now been done. If people keep extending their help as they have been doing so far - shout out to you for giving such great assistance - hopefully those badges not yet vetted will have been done as well and I will know which to return and which to keep. Please keep up the good work! THANK YOU!
One week return!!!. That sounds even more like railroading to me. Still, you pays your money, you takes your choice, as they say. Good luck with that.
  #54  
Old 11-05-21, 07:21 AM
Frank Kelley's Avatar
Frank Kelley Frank Kelley is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 7,220
Default

Okay, well my thoughts would now be to make your decision and conclude this business as soon as possible and be very careful what you buy and where you buy from in the future to avoid this from happening again.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kaiserwilhelm2 View Post
Hi Frank, THANK YOU for your continued interest and help with my collection in the making. After Luke's post and my reply I send an email to the seller pointing out the number of multi-source confirmed fakes so far (19) and that I was rather disappointed by this as these had been sold to me as originals. Seller replied he would keep his promise and take everything back that was considered bad/undesirable for full money back - so in case of your example 45 GBP paid is 45 GBP returned. As you will understand I am very keen to seperate the bad from the good while I still have the opportunity to get my money back for bad examples. Therefore I hope everyone will continue to help out with this process of selection for which I continue to be very greatful. Cheers, Tom
  #55  
Old 11-05-21, 08:20 AM
Frank Kelley's Avatar
Frank Kelley Frank Kelley is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 7,220
Default

Just out of interest, I note you use the term "multi source confirmed fakes" I assume to refer to them being confirmed as fake by members of this forum rather than actually "multi sourced" by the seller before being deliberately sold to you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaiserwilhelm2 View Post
Hi Frank, THANK YOU for your continued interest and help with my collection in the making. After Luke's post and my reply I send an email to the seller pointing out the number of multi-source confirmed fakes so far (19) and that I was rather disappointed by this as these had been sold to me as originals. Seller replied he would keep his promise and take everything back that was considered bad/undesirable for full money back - so in case of your example 45 GBP paid is 45 GBP returned. As you will understand I am very keen to seperate the bad from the good while I still have the opportunity to get my money back for bad examples. Therefore I hope everyone will continue to help out with this process of selection for which I continue to be very greatful. Cheers, Tom
  #56  
Old 11-05-21, 09:39 AM
kaiserwilhelm2 kaiserwilhelm2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Kelley View Post
Just out of interest, I note you use the term "multi source confirmed fakes" I assume to refer to them being confirmed as fake by members of this forum rather than actually "multi sourced" by the seller before being deliberately sold to you?
Hi Frank, yes the first i.e. confirmed as fakes here by more than one Forum member. Cheers, Tom
  #57  
Old 11-05-21, 10:03 AM
kaiserwilhelm2 kaiserwilhelm2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Kelley View Post
Okay, well my thoughts would now be to make your decision and conclude this business as soon as possible and be very careful what you buy and where you buy from in the future to avoid this from happening again.
I agree with concluding this business a.s.a.p. In order to do so I am still hoping a few more badges get second opinions on them so I am returning those that are not good while keeping the ones that are good. As for buying items I usually follow the same set of rules which are: buy from a knowledgable and trusted source, have a money back guarantee and get second opinions from those who are knowledgeable when lacking the necessary in some cases minute knowledge of the objects at hand. Now what is different here as opposed to previous dealings are several things:

- I am operating outside my own field of expertise more so than is usual (I am not a cap badge expert);

- although the source of these items appeared trustworthy and knowledgeable based on the search I did on this Forum (due diligence) or at least there were no warning signs - seeing that I was sold a number of fakes as originals question marks can now be placed with the source being trustworthy and/or knowledgeable - this has come as an unfortunate surprise;

- however I still have my money back guarantee which the seller has reconfirmed he will honour - so although not a great experience all should be well that ends well;

- now the only thing open is how many of the badges I will return to the seller. This is influenced by the feedback I get in the threads I have posted which has been good - thank you again - nevertheless I am still looking for some second opinions on others. Now I have gathered from two forum members that this is for some a sore point as I seem to have overstepped an invisible mark i.e. I have posted too many badges for second opinions. Although I have given some reasons why I have bought many badges in one go (high shipping costs of both receiving and returning, customs issues and, which I forgot to include, high transfer costs: my bank charges me about 6 GBP for transfering money to the UK as it is now outside the EU) which, makes it financially hard to collect badges in small amounts as the costs surrounding the purchase of a single badge are far outweighed by the costs that are associated with getting a badge in hand - with my big badge batch approach and posting these all on the Forum I seemed to have ruffled some feathers. The latter was not my intention and, if in doing so I unwittingly did, I appologize.

Last edited by kaiserwilhelm2; 11-05-21 at 10:31 AM.
  #58  
Old 11-05-21, 10:09 AM
manchesters's Avatar
manchesters manchesters is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 6,359
Default

Would you tell us what price in UK Pounds you are paying, for example, a standard Infantry badge? ie, Essex, Devon, East Yorks etc etc etc

regards
__________________
Simon Butterworth

Manchester Regiment Collector
Rank, Prize & Trade Badges
British & Commonwealth Artillery Badges
  #59  
Old 11-05-21, 10:11 AM
kaiserwilhelm2 kaiserwilhelm2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by manchesters View Post
Would you tell us what price in UK Pounds you are paying, for example, a standard Infantry badge? ie, Essex, Devon, East Yorks etc etc etc

regards
Differs a bit but let us say for what appear to be common badges anywhere from 6- 12 GBP.
  #60  
Old 11-05-21, 10:33 AM
manchesters's Avatar
manchesters manchesters is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 6,359
Default

Thats quite a difference, I would have expected on such a bulk deal to get an average price at the lower figure.

regards
__________________
Simon Butterworth

Manchester Regiment Collector
Rank, Prize & Trade Badges
British & Commonwealth Artillery Badges
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:09 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.