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  #16  
Old 12-02-21, 10:37 AM
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GriffMJ GriffMJ is offline
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Hi Luke

OTHER RANKS (in khaki)

This is a "DHIY" POWFs, it looks gilding metal.....but it was a bronzed badge, specifically a milk chocolate bronze. Traces of the bronze coat can still be found in the badge. This type was the first issue between 1902 and 1908. Many reasons for losing its bronze coat, one would be the sand blasting effect of Egypt and beyond.



This is, "DHY", the second issue, a dark chocolate bronze thats had the ribbons dinged upwards..... probably well after its active use. (1908-15)


This is the third issue (1915-20)


All of the above POWFs are the same manufacturer of the Officers version with the DH Scroll. See here - https://www.paoyeomanry.org.uk/DHYCapBadge.htm

*Blackened versions of the above I would attribute to the 15th (CSR) Londons.

** I AM SELLING MY DHY COLLECTION ** I have an other Ranks board and an Officers board, i do not want to split them.... so offers for the boards only please. PM me if you are interested.
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Last edited by GriffMJ; 12-02-21 at 11:03 AM.
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  #17  
Old 12-02-21, 11:05 AM
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any thoughts on these two Griff?

You already commented that the gaunt was not DH which I post again on its own






Quote:
Originally Posted by GriffMJ View Post
Hi Luke

OTHER RANKS (in khaki)

This is a "DHIY" POWFs, it looks gilding metal.....but it was a bronzed badge, specifically a milk chocolate bronze. Traces of the bronze coat can still be found in the badge. This type was the first issue between 1902 and 1908. Many reasons for losing its bronze coat, one would be the sand blasting effect of Egypt and beyond.



** I AM SELLING MY DHY COLLECTION ** I have an other Ranks board and an Officers board, i do not want to split them.... so offers for the boards only please. PM me if you are interested.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 2 p of w collars.jpg (69.0 KB, 18 views)
File Type: jpg 1 osd p of w collars.jpg (43.1 KB, 15 views)
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  #18  
Old 12-02-21, 11:10 AM
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Hi Jerry

No, I would not attribute to the DHIY or DHY.
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  #19  
Old 12-02-21, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GriffMJ View Post
Hi Jerry

No, I would not attribute to the DHIY or DHY.
ok, but why not, you said the dark one you showed had the scrolls pinged up but otherwise it seems identical to the one I showed (below). I appreciate you answering but without the detail it helps me not
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1 of 2 p of w collars.jpg (42.6 KB, 13 views)
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  #20  
Old 12-02-21, 11:28 AM
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Hi Jerry

Because its not a "die" seen in the Officers badges..... you will find bronzed POWFs ..... but RWY also had Bronzed POWFs in this period and if you look at their version its is different to the DHY. I have attached the RWIY blues Collars so you can see the WM Collars.... as in the cap (not bi-metal) .... for the Edwardian period.

There were many many POWFs made by different makers from the 2nd Boer War to 1920 and beyond. Many regiments wore them on the collar or in the cap or both. Colonial and Domestic. Another key thing to remember here is that the DHY were not around that long in "badge wearing" terms.... 20 years..... like all Yeomanry Regiments.... they had a budget and were supplied by one or two suppliers. They spent their active service overseas. Only the 2nd/1st and 3rd/1st DHY had the luxury of easy supply domestically.

The DHY I have confirmed are from direct evidence from "hi def" period photos or museum pieces in Wrexham.

I have examples, some ...not all, of "un confirmed" (not seen in photos or on museum pieces) DHY here -----> https://www.paoyeomanry.org.uk/DHYUnConCapbadge.htm
Attached Images
File Type: jpg RWIYCollars.jpg (53.8 KB, 15 views)
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"A Yeoman from the Stalwart Rural Cavalry"
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Last edited by GriffMJ; 12-02-21 at 12:05 PM.
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  #21  
Old 12-02-21, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke H View Post
The slider on this one on Dead Spartan is the mirror opposite with its edge.

My understanding of the manufacturing process of sliders is not great but to my novice eye it looks like they’ve made a wide slider and then cut it up the middle to make 2 sliders.

Is that idea too simplistic and coincidence?

They look hurriedly produced, could such a method speed up construction?
These are rolled flat bar or as they have been by others here extruded, it's simply a case of the slider being bent on one side for one and pulled out of the box the other side for the other.
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  #22  
Old 12-02-21, 01:19 PM
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You also encounter examples of the Welsh Horse with similar sliders, on rare occasion, I like to see similar with Great War cap badges.


Quote:
Originally Posted by magpie View Post
These are rolled flat bar or as they have been by others here extruded, it's simply a case of the slider being bent on one side for one and pulled out of the box the other side for the other.
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  #23  
Old 12-02-21, 03:52 PM
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Thanks again Griff

Quote:
Originally Posted by GriffMJ View Post
Hi Jerry

Because its not a "die" seen in the Officers badges..... you will find bronzed POWFs ..... but RWY also had Bronzed POWFs in this period and if you look at their version its is different to the DHY. I have attached the RWIY blues Collars so you can see the WM Collars.... as in the cap (not bi-metal) .... for the Edwardian period.

There were many many POWFs made by different makers from the 2nd Boer War to 1920 and beyond. Many regiments wore them on the collar or in the cap or both. Colonial and Domestic. Another key thing to remember here is that the DHY were not around that long in "badge wearing" terms.... 20 years..... like all Yeomanry Regiments.... they had a budget and were supplied by one or two suppliers. They spent their active service overseas. Only the 2nd/1st and 3rd/1st DHY had the luxury of easy supply domestically.

The DHY I have confirmed are from direct evidence from "hi def" period photos or museum pieces in Wrexham.

I have examples, some ...not all, of "un confirmed" (not seen in photos or on museum pieces) DHY here -----> https://www.paoyeomanry.org.uk/DHYUnConCapbadge.htm
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  #24  
Old 12-02-21, 04:40 PM
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Jerry

look at your own "Ceylon volunteers fs cap, Edwardian period" .... is that from the same die as the ones you show above?
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  #25  
Old 12-02-21, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryBB View Post
any thoughts on these two Griff?

You already commented that the gaunt was not DH which I post again on its own
Personally I wouldn’t be so quick to discount the DH. The Gaunt plate does suggest a Territorial commissioned piece and to date I’ve only seen a single London badge with such a plaque v’s several different Yeos.

Quote:
Originally Posted by magpie View Post
These are rolled flat bar or as they have been by others here extruded, it's simply a case of the slider being bent on one side for one and pulled out of the box the other side for the other.
Well that makes far more sense! Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Kelley View Post
You also encounter examples of the Welsh Horse with similar sliders, on rare occasion, I like to see similar with Great War cap badges.
I agree Frank, and that was my reason for choosing such a badge for my Yeomanry 1914 album - https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/fo...ctureid=191120

Genuine examples are also found with a slightly thicker tapering slider in both GM and bronzed GM. A very pleasing badge I’ve always thought.
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  #26  
Old 13-02-21, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GriffMJ View Post
Jerry

look at your own "Ceylon volunteers fs cap, Edwardian period" .... is that from the same die as the ones you show above?
I think you are referring to the temporary badge I placed for pics until the correct badge arrived, among those below. The correct badge is all wm on a slider, a most unusual badge
Attached Images
File Type: jpg p of w collars sets.jpg (44.9 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpg DSC_0284.jpg (48.9 KB, 73 views)
File Type: jpg ceylon volunteers wrong badge crop.jpg (73.7 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg ceylon volunteers correct badge crop.jpg (76.0 KB, 8 views)
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  #27  
Old 13-02-21, 01:40 PM
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Jerry

The top right.... looks DHY (post 1908 Blues) ....does the "H" touch the scroll edge?

My example, small rectangle or oval sweat hole in the back:-


* The bottom two look like Dowler made POWFs
** Top left, if it has a large circle sweat hole, I would attribute to an Edwardian 3DG or 12th Lancer collar

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Last edited by GriffMJ; 13-02-21 at 01:55 PM.
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  #28  
Old 13-02-21, 03:08 PM
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it has a small rectangular sweat hole Griff and both D & H touch the edge of the scroll

top left does have a circular sweathole
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File Type: jpg mixed bi metal p of w collars.jpg (75.2 KB, 7 views)
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  #29  
Old 13-02-21, 06:25 PM
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Griff
A bit shocked really to know that you are selling your DHY collection.
You have a rare and unique collection of a north Wales regiment, what about the Welsh military museums Griff worth giving them the opportunity to buy your wonderful collection.

Kind regards

Wyndham
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  #30  
Old 13-02-21, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by sadler32 View Post
Griff
A bit shocked really to know that you are selling your DHY collection.
You have a rare and unique collection of a north Wales regiment, what about the Welsh military museums Griff worth giving them the opportunity to buy your wonderful collection.

Kind regards

Wyndham
...... its ok Wyndham..... I have achieved what i wanted to achieve with the collection. I only really started it.... so I could get to grips with the Regiment It will not be broken up...... but it is available to the right person/entity if they want to buy it
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