Anodised Royal Horse Artillery Cap Badges

[hagwalther]

Hi Guys,

Putting together a chapter on badge parts and come across these two in my collection being a pair of RHA badges probably by different manufacturers as the rear casting used is different for both.

Which came first and why the change in fitting apparatus?

Regards

Chris

[engr9266]

HELLO CHRIS, I would say that the badge with the slider is a beret badge and the one with lugs is a collar badge. The slider badge I say is a beret as the RHA wear the normal RA gun badge when in No1 or No2 dress(peaked forage cap) unless it is 7 Regt RHA which is para trained and wear the maroon beret. Hope his helps, regards Jerry.

[Alan O]

I would add the the RHA refer to the beret badge as a cypher and get quite agitated when it is described as anything else.

Alan

[engr9266]

ALAN, I AM EX ROYAL ENGINEER and as we know the RE and RA are rivals. Remember the gun's!! So a badge is a badge

[Alan O]

Jerry,

Too true but you can always get a bite of the RHA about it especially if you refer to 7 RHA's headgear as 'hats' at the same time. The RAF PJIs used to tell the students to 'get their hats and coats' (refering to maroon berets and para smocks of course). Absolutley priceless!

[revdougal]

I believe the lugged cypher is predominately worn in a beret; of course it could be a collar, but today's collars have just the one lug.
Problem with the Sappers' jibe about the Guns is that they cannot tell you when it happened, nor where, which battle or even the campaign: and if they have a stab at answering, many are the conflicting stories. Anyway lost Guns are more like to be pulled out by the Cavalry - they have horses aplenty! Ever tried telling 17/21L or QRL that they wear a BADGE?

[tynesideirish]

Chris, The vast majority of Other Rank Horse Gunners (if not all!) wear a Collar badge in our beret's. I never wore a slidered beret badge nor knew anyone else who did. The AA one is disgarded and a White metal version is worn as befits the Regiment at the Right of the line!
Jerry is right A Large RA Gun badge is worn on the Cap by all non Airborne RHA Soldiers.

Jerry, We donkey Wallopers don't really get upset at the Royal Cypher being incorrectly called anything, or the old falsehood chestnuts about the yellow in our belts or the white lanyard... water off a ducks back.

True about the bite Alan! We all know a HAT is a 'craphat' or anyone not entitled to wearing a Maroon Machine [that especially includes anyone who wears one without doing P Company (or Glider training for you real Old and Bold!) TALO just doesn't cut it!]

However the biggest bite comes from the misuse of the regiments title. It is correctly: The DRA, CRA and Even our Captain General Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth ll calls us correctly 7th Parachute Regiment Royal Horse Artillery. 7 PARA RHA in abreviation.
Even our Batterys are 'F * (Sphinx), G * (Mercer's Troop), I * (Bull's Troop) or H * (Ramsey's Troop) [* being] Parachute Battery Royal Horse Artillery.

Notice NO brackets around the word Parachute. Also not 7 RHA not 7th Regiment RHA. It happens all the time on other sites as well, and may just be a wind up or ignorance. Either way it is wrong and it really winds me up! I've told you now so no excuse!

[revdougal]

This is getting away from the cypher at hand, but I always thought Her Maj is our "Captain General"!

[54Bty]

Of course the correct Battery titles for 7th Parachute Regiment Royal Horse Artillery are;

F (Sphinx) Parachute Battery Royal Horse Artillery
G Parachute Battery (Mercer's Troop) Royal Horse Artillery
H Parachute Headquarters Battery (Ramsey's Troop) Royal Horse Artillery
I Parachute Battery (Bull's Troop) Royal Horse Artillery


The Honour title is always placed directly after the letter or number unless it contains the word Company or Troop, then it is placed after Battery and before Royal Artillery or Royal Horse Artillery. As above.

Currently the above Regiment and 29th Commando Regiment Royal Artillery are the only Regiments to have the role in the title.

[hagwalther]

Thanks for all the reply's Guys.

Looks like things are never as simple as they appear.

Regards

Chris

[ORISKANY]

There should be a few spares of these badges going on to EBAY after the latest news about the Kings Troop!

[bess55]

Originally Posted by hagwalther

Hi Guys,

Putting together a chapter on badge parts and come across these two in my collection being a pair of RHA badges probably by different manufacturers as the rear casting used is different for both.

Which came first and why the change in fitting apparatus?

Regards

Chris

Chris,
getting back to your original question, I was hoping 54BTY would give the definitive answer on that one. He posted a reply to me once (which I cant find) re when the seeded/non-seeded and gold to silver versions came about. I'm sure he stated around 1971 on instructions of the DRA I believe. I have an early seeded gold one which has a slider and equally a seeded silver which has the two lugs as your picture. I always thought the double lugged badges were cap badges too. I could be wrong.

Incidentally, 54BTY if you do reply (or anyone else who can bottom out my enquiry), did the seeded GOLD and SILVER versions have seeded collar badges too? I asume they would but have never seen any and if so what fixing did they have, single post or double luggs like what I believe to be a cap badge?

Thanks guys

Regards to all

Bess

[54Bty]

When the gold RHA badge was in use (not by many) the collar badges were the standard RA Grenade (at least one Regiment wore chromed brass collar grenades). The RHA collar badge came in circa 1971 so by then it should have had no seeding and a single lug. As the collar badge had a single lug it was easy to see who was wearing one in the beret as the EIIR in the centre was solid. The directions from the DRA were for beret and cap badges, collar badges were not considered. I have not been able to find a pattern for the two lugged badge but I know that it was worn in the beret, although as mentioned earlier most members of the RHA purchased and wore a white metal badge in the beret, most of which had two lugs.

I have yet to see a member of The King's Troop Royal Horse Artillery wearing a beret the khaki peaked forage cap with Gun badge is the norm.

[bess55]

Thanks 54BTY, that makes it clearer certainly for me. So rule of thumb is:-

Gold seeded Capbadge - regular RA grenade collars (until 1971)

Silver seeded/non-seeded,double lugs or slider cap badge - proper RHA collars
with single post
(not seeded)

Unless I havnt understood it right. Thanks again mate.

Regards all

Bess

Originally Posted by 54Bty

When the gold RHA badge was in use (not by many) the collar badges were the standard RA Grenade (at least one Regiment wore chromed brass collar grenades). The RHA collar badge came in circa 1971 so by then it should have had no seeding and a single lug. As the collar badge had a single lug it was easy to see who was wearing one in the beret as the EIIR in the centre was solid. The directions from the DRA were for beret and cap badges, collar badges were not considered. I have not been able to find a pattern for the two lugged badge but I know that it was worn in the beret, although as mentioned earlier most members of the RHA purchased and wore a white metal badge in the beret, most of which had two lugs.

I have yet to see a member of The King's Troop Royal Horse Artillery wearing a beret the khaki peaked forage cap with Gun badge is the norm.