Colonial Badge Experts Needed

[Brinnie]

I posted a picture of a badge in the mystery insignia section of this forum two days ago. I was advised to post it in the Australian section where someone may better be able to provide information about the badge.
I found the badge in Coolgardie WA. It was among scattered glass suggesting it had been deliberately discarded. The glass dated from around the 1890s. It has two lugs on the rear. The top is complete but the cross on the crown has been bent back. The central letters are ADR. It has been suggested it could be an Albany Defence Rifles badge as the button used by them has the same letters and style along with a crown above (the button is in the Cossum book).
I have two questions :
Has anyone ever seen another of these badges, either directly or in any publication; physical, electronic or otherwise?
In the absence of any knowledge of others is it reasonable to be able to claim it to be very likely an Albany Defence Rifles badge? Especially given:
1. The same lettering and crown as ADR buttons;
2. The age of the glass it was found with (1890s);
3. No alternative Albany Defence Rifles badge exists;
4. The ADR numbered around 80 members at the peak of its brief 3 year existence;
5. No one seems to be able to provide evidence that this specific badge belonged to another group.
I may seem a little pushy but I'm simply trying to nail down the badge's origins. At least as far as is reasonably possible.
Thanks in advance,
Bryan.

[Brinnie]

Originally Posted by Brinnie

I posted a picture of a badge in the mystery insignia section of this forum two days ago. I was advised to post it in the Australian section where someone may better be able to provide information about the badge.
I found the badge in Coolgardie WA. It was among scattered glass suggesting it had been deliberately discarded. The glass dated from around the 1890s. It has two lugs on the rear. The top is complete but the cross on the crown has been bent back. The central letters are ADF. It has been suggested it could be an Albany Defence Rifles badge as the button used by them has the same letters and style along with a crown above (the button is in the Cossum book).
I have two questions :
Has anyone ever seen another of these badges, either directly or in any publication; physical, electronic or otherwise?
In the absence of any knowledge of others is it reasonable to be able to claim it to be very likely an Albany Defence Rifles badge? Especially given:
1. The same lettering and crown as ADF buttons;
2. The age of the glass it was found with (1890s);
3. No alternative Albany Defence Rifles badge exists;
4. The ADR numbered around 80 members at the peak of its brief 3 year existence;
5. No one seems to be able to provide evidence that this specific badge belonged to another group.
I may seem a little pushy but I'm simply trying to nail down the badge's origins. At least as far as is reasonably possible.
Thanks in advance,
Bryan.

I forgot the picture.

[mike_vee]

ERROR !


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[Brinnie]

Originally Posted by mike_vee

ERROR !


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I'm not sure what you mean Mike, have I done something wrong?

[mike_vee]

Originally Posted by Brinnie

I'm not sure what you mean Mike, have I done something wrong?

I meant that I had posted in the wrong thread .


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[kingsley]

Bryan, your reasoning makes sense, and I would agree to identify it as Albany and consistent with Jeff Cossum's button. All the pre-fed insignia is quite scarce because of the low numbers that served in the WA regiments. For this reason, comparatively few collectors attempt to collect them. It took me years to find a sample collection.
One of the best collections in existence belonged to Bob Gray, who was a member of the 27th Bn SA Scottish Rifles in the 1930s and died in the 1980s. He was a great help to me in my younger days and I posted a photo of him in uniform on the Forum years ago. He left his collection to the SA Army museum, where current authors can access his badges. I don't think they are shown online.
Years ago I obtained a series of photos of his original collection and his pre-1900 badges are amazing. I don't have access to my badge files at present but will find them and post his incredible WA collection next week. Can't remember if your badge is among them.
If you want to collect easier badges to find, let me know if I can find you a swap. I might be able to find something dear to your heart.

[David191]

Seems Kingsley may have a good lead to identify this badge.
May be worth sending this website a message too? https://wacolonialmilitary.com/

Best regards,
David

[vigilans]

Here is a pic of the Grey WA collection - not sure if it is the one you had in mind Kingsley or if it is his complete WA lot? 2nd down left in cloth is (I think) Albany Defence ......? Rifles?? Kingsley you may have a better pic

[Brinnie]

Thankyou very much gentlemen, you have exceeded my expectations.
I shall contact the website suggested as a follow up.
I'm not a full blown collector of military items but have become one of sorts by default. I have found a few metal detecting over the years and keep those. I have also scored a few from my now elderly father. I keep those that I find and would only part with duplicates. It would be extremely unlikely that I'll turn up another AFR badge.
I recently found a Perth Infantry badge with the word 'vigilans' cut out along with a central cut out swan. Given that it is a Perth badge I presume it would be reasonably common.
Again, thankyou very much.
Best regards, Bryan.

[kingsley]

The Gray photo just posted is the same as mine and the only one I have seen. Many badges are so rare that no one has ever seen another and he probably located them in the 1930s or before.
The cut out 'Vigilans' badge sounds like a 1903-12 11th Australian Infantry Regiment rising sun collar badge, worn with a star-shaped hat badge of similar design to the 1930-42 type.
Bryan, it might be worth a try to ask the SA army museum is they have an Albany badge like yours.

[Brinnie]

Thanks Kingsley, I'll give that a go.
Incidentally, here's a picture of the vigilans badge. I was wrong about the word vigilans being cut out. My memory is not what it once was.

[mike_vee]

From a 2008 thread :

The badge of the 88th Battalion AMF The Perth Infantry worn 1912 -18

https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/fo...ead.php?t=1739


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[mike_vee]

Also found this :

88th Infantry (Perth Battalion).

Head-Quarters - Perth

Machine Gun Section - Perth

"A" Company - North Perth

"B" Company - Perth, Perth University

"C" Company - Perth

"D" Company - Victoria Park, Maylands

"E" Company - Northam, York, Toodyay, Wagin, Katanning, Albany

"F" Company - Midland Junction, Guildford

"G" Company - East Perth

"H" Company - Geraldton, Cue, Day Dawn

https://alh-research.tripod.com/Ligh...strict-part-2/


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[mike_vee]

From an article in "The Queenslander" newspaper dated 09 April 1931 , titled "Bits Of Metal" (What they tell us of military history).

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/23137486


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[kingsley]

Adam Watson's 'Bits of Metal' articles in the 1931 Queensland newspaper were, as far as I know, the first ever publications of Australian badge pictures. I have photocopies of all of them in a book somewhere. I think they were a series over nine weeks. He was a contemorary of Bob Gray.