Officer Beret RTR - Bullion Cap Badge

[Little black devil]

Hi,
I purchase this officer black beret in Normandy last June.
The guy didn't know very much what it was. I bought it for nothing.
I have a doubt about the bullion cap badge but the beret is a good tailor made.
There was a CB before (see photo attached) then it was changed to a Bullion CB.
What do you think about it? Is it 2nd WW, late war or post war?
Is the Bullion CB is authentically sewn on?

Thank you.

Frederick

[Mike_2817]

Bullion Beret Badges are worn by Officers & Warrant Officers Class One, so a WOII promoted would change badges but probably not his beret, which with that type of headband is post war.
Possibly his working beret.

[oc14]

The style of headband on the beret would suggest a late 1970s/early 1980s beret. RTR officers do not normally wear bullion beret badges like the majority of regiments and corps. Perhaps a cadet force officers beret ?

PL

[Old Smelly]

Not sure on the date of this one but some WW2 private purchase berets have this type of band.
Lee

[matti467]

No sign of a bullion officers cap badge in the family RTC/RTR album 1923-42.
Matti

[1stTankie]

Hi Frederick

This type of beret badge was worn by the officers, and possibly the RSM, of 2RTR only. I'm not sure when the fashion started but it could have been linked to the introduction or termination of the Officers' "Full Dress" astrakan beret. In my time in the regiment (1RTR and 4RTR) and on various other appointments (1956-1988) I wore the usual metal badge.This astrakan beret was almost universally disliked by the officers and was quickly discarded following the passing of the designer. Dates escape me at the moment but I will try to resurrect them.

Best wishes

Gordon

[1stTankie]

Originally Posted by oc14

The style of headband on the beret would suggest a late 1970s/early 1980s beret. RTR officers do not normally wear bullion beret badges like the majority of regiments and corps. Perhaps a cadet force officers beret ?

PL

Hi PL

That type of headband was worn by me wef 1956.

Best wishes

Gordon

[oc14]

Originally Posted by 1stTankie

Hi PL

That type of headband was worn by me wef 1956.

Best wishes

Gordon

I stand corrected. When I first joined (in 1976), all issue berets were leather banded, in the late 70s and early 80s these "fabric" banded berets beagn to appear as an issue item, by the late 80s we were back to leather banded berets (as I was neither a) born or b) serving in 1956 I cannot confirm or otherwise, what was being issued in those days)

regards

PL

[fearnaught]

Hi, astrakhan beret introduced 1961, dropped 12 years later. First beret bullion badge had what looks like a king's crown but later ones had a queen's crown. Impressed the hell out of a German training group who went home and had their own version made. Mike

[grey_green_acorn]

Originally Posted by 1stTankie

Hi Frederick

This type of beret badge was worn by the officers, and possibly the RSM, of 2RTR only. I'm not sure when the fashion started but it could have been linked to the introduction or termination of the Officers' "Full Dress" astrakan beret. In my time in the regiment (1RTR and 4RTR) and on various other appointments (1956-1988) I wore the usual metal badge.This astrakan beret was almost universally disliked by the officers and was quickly discarded following the passing of the designer. Dates escape me at the moment but I will try to resurrect them.

Best wishes

Gordon

My OC at the RAC Training Regiment (Catterick) in 1969/1970 was a Captain from 2RTR. I am pretty sure he wore the embroidered badge on his Astrakan and working dress beret.

Tim

[fearnaught]

Hi, last badge is one "made for collectors". Mike

[Little black devil]

Thank you for your answer.
I saw many tailor made beret like this one. The headband was not made in leather.
Anyway, you know more than I know so thank you once again for your help.

Fred

[1stTankie]

Originally Posted by oc14

I stand corrected. When I first joined (in 1976), all issue berets were leather banded, in the late 70s and early 80s these "fabric" banded berets beagn to appear as an issue item, by the late 80s we were back to leather banded berets (as I was neither a) born or b) serving in 1956 I cannot confirm or otherwise, what was being issued in those days)

regards

PL

Hi PL

These were not issue berets. Officers had to buy them from the regimental tailor and they were impossible to shape into anything even half acceptable as a "tankie" beret!

Best wishes

Gordon

[revdougal]

Back in 1970s I would concur that 2 RTR Officers (and no doubt the RSM) wore the bullion badge, while 1 and 3 RTR wore silver/wm - as I suspect 4 RTR did.
2 RTR also wore a black Guernsey pullover, whereas 1 RTR wore the issue style pullover dyed black, and 3 RTR wore a green one much of the time. I often felt that the RTR Regiments were very "individual", although only just of the same family - but of course I was an outsider looking in, but still have my Ash Plant!

[Luc]

The stitching of the lining clearly shows the beret dates to the fifties or after. Wartime berets were made notably different.