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  #16  
Old 08-11-14, 08:43 PM
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1936 - uncle George joined the WG in 1936 I think, left end of WWII - fits with the lugged badge he gave me (posted it along with one of his cloth shoulder titles to my cousin, his son, in Australia a few years ago so no photos).
Picked up a WG Musicians cap a few years ago, a Silbermans dated 1952, anodised buttons though I can't remember whether Kings or Queens crown, currently fitted with an anodised badge.
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  #17  
Old 16-11-14, 02:07 PM
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When the 2nd Bn was raised in WWII they where issued the lugged badges. The 2nd Bn where a tank battalion and served in 6th Guards Armoured. The 1st & 3rd Bn where both issued with sliders. The usual theory is that the 2nd Bn where issued with lugged badges because they where in tanks and a lugged badge was more secure. The truth is no one knows for sure, but a lugged badge would be difficult to fit on a Welsh Guards forage cap.
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  #18  
Old 16-11-14, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john badge View Post
When the 2nd Bn was raised in WWII they where issued the lugged badges. The 2nd Bn where a tank battalion and served in 6th Guards Armoured. The 1st & 3rd Bn where both issued with sliders. The usual theory is that the 2nd Bn where issued with lugged badges because they where in tanks and a lugged badge was more secure. The truth is no one knows for sure, but a lugged badge would be difficult to fit on a Welsh Guards forage cap.
John,
This is anecdotal and and as you say unsubstantiated. Welsh Guards recruits arriving at the Guards Depot (at that point their eventual Bn would be unknown) were most likely issued the standard pattern badge worn since 1915, which would have had a slider. Julian's (KLR) discovery of the official dating of the "Lugged" badge, probably coincides with a Request from the 2nd Bn after excessive losses of cap badges to the "Hull Monster" for a more suitable and secure means of fitment? Recruits arriving from the Depot after completing training would most likely have continued to wear whatever badge they received on initial issue and only on the occasion of a loss would these have been replaced with a lugged badge? The lugged badge may have been issued to everyone in the 2nd Bn for wear in the beret, however as you say it is impossible to fit a lugged badge to a WG Forage Cap without causing damage and even then, due to the construction of the cap the badge would not sit as neatly as it was intended (Roots Resting on the Chin Strap)!

Andy
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  #19  
Old 09-01-19, 04:12 PM
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The spread of the leaves on the leak will vary because some soldiers went to some lengths to get the "look" right.
Any time I show one to my father, who's now in his 90's, he still comments on how it doesn't look right & then sets about bending the thing to his taste, or rather the taste of the 1st Bn circa WWII.
One of his brothers who was in 1st & 2nd Bns 1930's / WWII gave me his old WG cap badge decades ago, first thing my father did when he saw it was start wrestling with the leaves & break off the upper lug.
That solid struck one my father declared a "proper" badge, better & more delicate looking than some WWII era ones.
According to him the lugged badges were usually adapted within 1st Bn by having the lugs replaced with sliders simply for ease of removal for cleaning.
A WG badge that's undergone a lugs to slider conversion - lugs very neatly removed, purpose made (thinner metal than usual) slider added.
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  #20  
Old 09-01-19, 08:23 PM
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Apparently this Welsh Guards Leek maker marked is the scarcer earlier pattern, so I've been told.
Andy

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  #21  
Old 09-01-19, 08:54 PM
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I like it, one I haven't got - has that got the little inverted triangle hollow at the base of the leek, like the one shown earlier in the thread?
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  #22  
Old 09-01-19, 10:28 PM
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I like it, one I haven't got - has that got the little inverted triangle hollow at the base of the leek, like the one shown earlier in the thread?
Do you mean in the rear of the badge Leigh ? If so it is hollowed out.
Andy
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  #23  
Old 09-01-19, 10:29 PM
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Like this Leigh ?
Andy
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  #24  
Old 09-01-19, 10:48 PM
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Sorry, yes, I should have said on the back - I was thinking of the reverse of the badge in post no. 7.
I don't have and haven't seen any WG of that type, I think, only flat backed or hollow struck.
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  #25  
Old 10-01-19, 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman View Post
Apparently this Welsh Guards Leek maker marked is the scarcer earlier pattern, so I've been told.
Andy

A lovely badge Andy.
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  #26  
Old 10-01-19, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leigh kitchen View Post
Sorry, yes, I should have said on the back - I was thinking of the reverse of the badge in post no. 7.
I don't have and haven't seen any WG of that type, I think, only flat backed or hollow struck.
Leigh, do you have any idea on chronology of the hollow struck types?
I have one with lugs and one with a slider.
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  #27  
Old 10-01-19, 08:58 PM
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Sorry, no, I can remember my father looking at my uncles (served about 1936 - 45) lugged solid back badge and saying it was a good, pre-WWII badge and mentioning the common practise (at least in the 1st Bn) of having the lugs removed and a slider fitted, and also looking at a hollow back slidered badge and virtually sneering that it was a wartime introduction.
Which of course, doesn't necessarily mean he was right, just that he remembered the solid backs giving way to the hollow backs.
I have a lugged hollow back as well, but don't know the significance - unless it's a Sgts & Musician's one?
I'll check.
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