Guards Machine gun badge.

[Alan O]

I recently bought an ebay lot of badges from the US as it contained a Q/C a/a Loyal Regiment cap badge. Included in the lot were a couple of restrikes including this Machine Gun Guards. The later all brass version is faked as well, but badly made. Knocked out for £6.50 by a cab driver in wales.

These are also widely faked and if there was ever a badge which is indistinguishable from the real thing then this is it. It must be a candidate for an original die being used. The copies come on lugs and sliders but I think the originals were on sliders.

This one is very deep, perfectly struck but has not been artifically aged so it is obvious that it is not 90 years old. It also has the Gaunt B'ham mark so I suspect that it was one of the scarce WW1 badges that Gaunt knocked out in the 1970s as gap fillers. If ever you needed an example of a Gaunt Bham slider on a repro badge then this is it. I would dearly like to know if the Gaunt stamp was used by the company in the 50s and 60s but I suspect that it was not. While I only have a couple of yeomanry bades in brass with the Bham stamp, I do have a number of a/a badges dating from units in existance circa 1960 onwards and I am not sure whether these were made for the commercial market or not. Until a couple of years ago there was an old elecrical and household shop in Bulford shopping row which also sold a/a cap badges. The old chap (he was well over 70) had boxes of now long obselete badges in stock including Rhants, ACC, RCT but also some rare ones including the Royal Scots Greys.

Gaunt were certainly supplying the Army in the 1960s and 70s with badges but there remains an uncertainty about what they reproduced in the 70s for the collectors market in a/a.
All comments welcome

Alan

[tynesideirish]

Here's some GMG images to compliment the one shown.
Other Ranks.
Officers front & rear.
Sweetheart front & rear.

[natal01]

I have been going through an old South African badge collection and came across this Guards Machine Gun Regiment badge in brass and enamel. According to Kipling and King this badge was in white metal for ORs and silver and enamel for officers. So what is this ? Can anyone help ?

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by natal01

I have been going through an old South African badge collection and came across this Guards Machine Gun Regiment badge in brass and enamel. According to Kipling and King this badge was in white metal for ORs and silver and enamel for officers. So what is this ? Can anyone help ?

I cannot be sure but the most likely scenario is that this is a badge worn by Full Serjeants or Warrant Officers. It has long been the practice in the Foot Guards and Scottish Line that SNCOs/WOs wear a different badge to both officers and men. Although the Guards Machine Gun Battalion (not 'Regiment', which came later from a merger with Household Cavalry machine gunners and had a different badge) had but a short life, I would be very surprised if they did not follow this practice.

I would like to agree with Toby on this one. I have had (from memory) 4 of these through my hands in 40 years and on each occasion, they were included in Guards collections which had other ranks' through to officers' patterns and on all 4 occasions were identified as senior nco's. Without doubt, all 4 collections were genuine. It is a nice badge and a scarce one, well worthy of a place in any Foot Guards collection. Regards. David

[Jibba Jabba]

Frankly I think the badge is a bad one. A typical bowed slider as found on fakes, polish pushed into the recesses on the reverse of the badge with no sign of any damage to enamel on the front from cleaning e.g discolouration from polish and nearly all guards enamal badges are being faked. Sorry Dave I`m not with you on this one, I`d put this badge with the fake guards cadet battalion.

JJ - How many fake examples of this badge have you come across ? May I open that question to others, also. Regards. David

[Deejayuu]

This badge i beleive to be a repro. Two give aways. The badge is on lugs and it should be on a slider. If you look closely at the bullets they are grainy where the original should be smooth. Have attached a couple of scans of what i beleive to be originals. One wm the other all brass.
As a side note, does not our infamous cabdriver accept paypal with a full money back guarantee?

Keep smiling. Dave

[orasot]

Dave & Paul are bang on I think. Only good ones I've seen have had sliders, here's mine for you, looks like a number scratched into the slider but I can't make it out fully, bullets are smooth as Dave said, all the crap I've seen has pitted ones, all the best, Wilf.

[KLR]

But yes, I agree with the previous comments - the WO records show that this one was issued with a slider !
(the official WO [ACD] records are open to the public - they are at Kew for anyone who cares to go along there; you, me, dealers, etc, etc !!!)

[QOSY]

Originally Posted by orasot

Dave & Paul are bang on I think. Only good ones I've seen have had sliders, here's mine for you, looks like a number scratched into the slider but I can't make it out fully, bullets are smooth as Dave said, all the crap I've seen has pitted ones, all the best, Wilf.

I have this one which is solid silver (marked silver on the top bullet) would this be an officers cap badge or collar?

[2747andy]

Gentlemen and Ladies, as I'm sure there are some Lady collectors out there too (that is ladies who collect badges and not Gentlemen who collect ladies).

This Thread is intended as a bit of fun and also may prove of use to those who (until now) thought they had a Genuine Guards Machine Gun Battalion badge in their collection!

The Guards MG Bn was formed in 1916 and although only around for about 2 years there seems to be an abundance of badges on the market (most of which are copies).

Below is a picture which contains 6 Gds MG Bn Cap Stars (badges), which if any are Pukka genuine items and which are "Chippy" repros? I will post a reply with my solution in the form of an album within the next day or so, until then please study the images, at least one is Genuine. Please do not ask to see the backs as this will come with the reply post!

All for now! - Andy

p.s.

(Guards headdress badges based on stars are known as "Cap Stars" not badges and Guards Officers wear rank Stars not pips! Pips are what you find in oranges and similar citrus fruits)

(Chippy is a term used by Guardsman when refering to something that is NOT Guards)

[Arnhemjim]

Andy,
If the learned experts in this forum are correct, the top three with sliders can be rejected out of hand. I do not think the voided badge is correct. Of the remaining two on the bottom I would pick the one on the left, if it is correctly lugged. The one on the lower right has a pewter color to it. Now tell me why I'm wrong. Belay my last! For some reason(s), perhaps a senior moment or two, I had become what I term "target fixated" on WWII Canadian Parachute Corps (NO SLIDERS) badges, and applied the same criteria to Gds MG Bn badges. Oh well, an interesting exercise none the less.
Jim

[Phillip Herring]

I am going to guess that the central, voided "star" is genuine. I have a similar one which has a red cloth backing in the void, held in place with a circular disc/folding tangs.

Phil

[dragonz18]

Middle /left ,as viewed.
Cheers !
Steve