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  #16  
Old 13-08-18, 04:42 AM
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Brian Conyngham Brian Conyngham is offline
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Keith

I see you have a blackened WW1 SAHA badge, not many around.

Brian
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  #17  
Old 13-08-18, 08:14 AM
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Hi Brian, yes, it is a nice bronzed one. I also have the smaller version and am intrigued by what it is having seen the previous posts which establish that it was not worn as a collar.

I hadn't realised the 19 Rocket Regt badges were so scarce, I gather it had a fairly short existence?

Keith
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  #18  
Old 13-08-18, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by fairlie63 View Post
Hi Brian, yes, it is a nice bronzed one. I also have the smaller version and am intrigued by what it is having seen the previous posts which establish that it was not worn as a collar.

I hadn't realised the 19 Rocket Regt badges were so scarce, I gather it had a fairly short existence?

Keith
Hi Keith

Yes, those small SAHA appear to be more "sweetheart brooches" than collar badges. I have silver and brass versions. I have somewhere a photostat of a WW1 era advert from a SA Jeweler (based Cape Town if I recall?), showing them being sold as brooches. Just wish I could find it, filed away in my research somewhere.

Yes, from what I remember the 19 Rocket Regt was disbanded back in the 1990's (stand to be corrected, and hope for some clarity on this) BUT who took over using these weapon systems, I am not sure. The SA Artillery still use them, that I do know.

The rarest SADF era artillery badge is the Regt East Transvaal badge with a small rat in it. In Afrikaans their name is Regt Oos Transvaal thereby giving the initials ROT, which is a Rat in that language. Apparently only around 25 ever issued officially, and these only to Officers and senior NCO's of high standing in the unit. They were Approved on the 23rd September 1992. If you see one buy it quickly, they sell quick when they do show up. One was recently found in a scratch box at a flea market in Pretoria, the guy paid around 5 pounds for it, a total bargain!The vendor obviously did not know what it was. You can see one in the bottom right hand corner of the first frame picture. They were an Anti Aircraft unit.

Brian

Last edited by Brian Conyngham; 14-08-18 at 04:12 AM.
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  #19  
Old 14-08-18, 07:27 AM
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Hi Brian,

44 Bty of 4 Arty Regt are apparently the current operators of the MLRS.

I do have one of the ROT badges, second line from the bottom on my khaki board. I didn't realise they were so hard to get.

I see you are from Durban - did the Durban Garrison Artillery during their short existence wear the 'gun' badge with NATAL in the top banner? They must have disappeared soon after the Great War.

Keith
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  #20  
Old 14-08-18, 01:02 PM
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Hi Keith, I have a DGA title. Not sure what cap badge they would have worn. Maybe Brian can add? Regards Andrew
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  #21  
Old 14-08-18, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Traist View Post
Hi Keith, I have a DGA title. Not sure what cap badge they would have worn. Maybe Brian can add? Regards Andrew
Hi Andrew

I am yet to find a close up picture of the DGA wearing insignia in WW1. However as the DGA were made up of NFA gunners of all ranks I have often considered that they might well of worn the NFA badge the same way the Cape Garrison Artillery wore the Cape Colony badge during WW1. It would make me a happy collector to one day verify this.

See below for some info on the DGA that comes out a manuscript I have been compiling for 10 or more odd years on SA Artillery regiments and formations.

Regards
Brian

Durban Garrison Artillery (DGA). The DGA was raised in 1912 from personal of “A” and “B” Batteries of the Natal Field Artillery under Lt-Col. C Wilson as a unit of the Union Defence Force (UDF). Strength consisted of six officers and 75 other ranks. It was the Second Division of the South African Garrison Artillery (SAGA), the First Division of the South African Garrison Artillery being the Cape Garrison Artillery. The Durban Garrison Artillery initially manned four 15-pounder guns mounted on the concrete gun-pits on Durban’s Bluff, which had been abandoned a few years previously by the Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve, and another emplacement at the “Back Beach” opposite to where Natal Command is today. These “Back Beach” gun emplacements still exist today minus their armaments.

In August 1914 within 13 months of being formed they mobilized and manned the batteries defending Durban Harbour under war conditions at the outbreak of the World War 1. In 1915 it supplied men for “N” Battery armed with 6-inch 30-cwt howitzers for service in German South West Africa, and also for “K” Heavy Battery under Lt. Vowles. K. Battery with two 12 pr. Naval guns on field carriages with ox draught, served with Berrange’s Eastern Force, which moved across the desert into the south-east of German South West Africa.

After the German South West African campaign these troops became available for service in other War theatres, including France. In France many of these Natal gunners formed a large part of the 75th Siege Battery Royal Garrison Artillery and because of this they became known as the 75th Natal Siege Battery RGA.

By 1918 the Durban Bluff garrison had been upgraded with two 6-inch guns, and two 3-inch QF Naval guns in new emplacements and were manned by the members of the Durban Garrison Artillery.

In 1921 their duties were taken over by the South African Permanent Garrison Artillery, staffed mainly by Permanent Force members and by the outbreak of the World War 2 the various garrisons had been once again been upgraded. It was due to the effective coastal defences along the coast that no German raiders ever engaged any targets at our ports during the war years.
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  #22  
Old 14-08-18, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by fairlie63 View Post
Hi Brian,

44 Bty of 4 Arty Regt are apparently the current operators of the MLRS.

I do have one of the ROT badges, second line from the bottom on my khaki board. I didn't realise they were so hard to get.

I see you are from Durban - did the Durban Garrison Artillery during their short existence wear the 'gun' badge with NATAL in the top banner? They must have disappeared soon after the Great War.

Keith
Hi Keith

Thanks for that info, I was told that the 4th had some MLRS but the way things go out here one can never be sure.

Well done on the ROT badge see it on your board, I missed it on my first inspection.

I have posted a bit on the DGA hope you find it interesting?

Regards
Brian
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  #23  
Old 14-08-18, 06:53 PM
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fairlie63 fairlie63 is offline
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Great info, thanks Brian. Material on SA Arty is hard to get hold of, although I have Ultima Ratio Regum and the histories of the CFA and THA.

I find collecting much more interesting when you know something about the units themselves, otherwise it's just a piece of metal.

Thanks Andrew, the DGA title must be hard to get hold of.

Cheers, Keith
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  #24  
Old 15-08-18, 04:40 AM
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Brian Conyngham Brian Conyngham is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fairlie63 View Post
Great info, thanks Brian. Material on SA Arty is hard to get hold of, although I have Ultima Ratio Regum and the histories of the CFA and THA.

I find collecting much more interesting when you know something about the units themselves, otherwise it's just a piece of metal.

Thanks Andrew, the DGA title must be hard to get hold of.

Cheers, Keith
Hi Keith

There are a few very good books relating to info on our artillery regiments and their mainly WW2 service, but they are getting hard and expensive to find these days. Hence my manuscript which has attempted to gather info, albeit snippets in some cases, on the many artillery units over the last 300 years or so.

Closer to home for me, the long overdue official history of the Natal Field Artillery was initially compiled years ago but due to certain disagreements between a few Wartime officers, was never published. However a few years ago the mantle was taken up by the late Ken Gillings, an ex RSM of the Regt. and he edited much of the original book and added post WW2 information. My small input was a few pictures of badges and medals for the book. The manuscript was sent for proof reading to a chap in Johannesburg. Sadly Ken passed away tragically 2 years ago, when he drowned whist on holiday. It now appears the project has ground to a halt without his driving force.

Regards
Brian
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  #25  
Old 15-08-18, 04:47 AM
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Hi Brian, this is great info. You must forge ahead with this project. It is needed. Have a great day. Andrew

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Conyngham View Post
Hi Andrew

I am yet to find a close up picture of the DGA wearing insignia in WW1. However as the DGA were made up of NFA gunners of all ranks I have often considered that they might well of worn the NFA badge the same way the Cape Garrison Artillery wore the Cape Colony badge during WW1. It would make me a happy collector to one day verify this.

See below for some info on the DGA that comes out a manuscript I have been compiling for 10 or more odd years on SA Artillery regiments and formations.

Regards
Brian

Durban Garrison Artillery (DGA). The DGA was raised in 1912 from personal of “A” and “B” Batteries of the Natal Field Artillery under Lt-Col. C Wilson as a unit of the Union Defence Force (UDF). Strength consisted of six officers and 75 other ranks. It was the Second Division of the South African Garrison Artillery (SAGA), the First Division of the South African Garrison Artillery being the Cape Garrison Artillery. The Durban Garrison Artillery initially manned four 15-pounder guns mounted on the concrete gun-pits on Durban’s Bluff, which had been abandoned a few years previously by the Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve, and another emplacement at the “Back Beach” opposite to where Natal Command is today. These “Back Beach” gun emplacements still exist today minus their armaments.

In August 1914 within 13 months of being formed they mobilized and manned the batteries defending Durban Harbour under war conditions at the outbreak of the World War 1. In 1915 it supplied men for “N” Battery armed with 6-inch 30-cwt howitzers for service in German South West Africa, and also for “K” Heavy Battery under Lt. Vowles. K. Battery with two 12 pr. Naval guns on field carriages with ox draught, served with Berrange’s Eastern Force, which moved across the desert into the south-east of German South West Africa.

After the German South West African campaign these troops became available for service in other War theatres, including France. In France many of these Natal gunners formed a large part of the 75th Siege Battery Royal Garrison Artillery and because of this they became known as the 75th Natal Siege Battery RGA.

By 1918 the Durban Bluff garrison had been upgraded with two 6-inch guns, and two 3-inch QF Naval guns in new emplacements and were manned by the members of the Durban Garrison Artillery.

In 1921 their duties were taken over by the South African Permanent Garrison Artillery, staffed mainly by Permanent Force members and by the outbreak of the World War 2 the various garrisons had been once again been upgraded. It was due to the effective coastal defences along the coast that no German raiders ever engaged any targets at our ports during the war years.
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  #26  
Old 15-08-18, 04:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fairlie63 View Post
Great info, thanks Brian. Material on SA Arty is hard to get hold of, although I have Ultima Ratio Regum and the histories of the CFA and THA.

I find collecting much more interesting when you know something about the units themselves, otherwise it's just a piece of metal.

Thanks Andrew, the DGA title must be hard to get hold of.

Cheers, Keith
Hi Keith, Thank you. Yes, it took me years to find the DGA title and I have only seen another one elsewhere. Have a great day. Andrew
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  #27  
Old 15-08-18, 05:42 AM
Alex Rice Alex Rice is offline
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Any chance of a close-up of the ROT badge, I'd never heard of it until now.
Cheers,
Alex
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  #28  
Old 15-08-18, 08:56 AM
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fairlie63 fairlie63 is offline
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Here it is Alex.

Keith
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  #29  
Old 15-08-18, 10:30 AM
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Here it is Alex.

Keith
Any idea how many ROT beret badges were actually made rather than just the 25 or so issued please?
I picked mine up from a dealer in Wales a year or two ago, they strike me as a badge ripe for repro'ing.
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  #30  
Old 15-08-18, 05:21 PM
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Brian Conyngham Brian Conyngham is offline
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Leigh

Nice example, mine is missing the double layer plastic backings. (Light Blue and red =anti-aircraft)

I have no idea how many were made but suspect a few more than than the 25 issued. Not sure what a minimum order would be by the company who made them, and I suspect in this case "Metal Art" in Pretoria? It has that look about it, they produced many of the SADF era badges.

Brian
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