Manchester Fany & VAD's

[Gerryd]

Originally Posted by Home Guard

I found this in a quick search, but it only refers to those who were allowed to go to the fronts.

"At first the military authorities were unwilling to accept VADs on the front-line. However, this restriction was removed in 1915 and women volunteers over the age of twenty-three and with more than three months experience, were allowed to go to the Western Front, Mesopotamia and Gallipoli. Later VADs were sent to the Eastern Front."

Source - https://spartacus-educational.com/FWWnurses.htm

Also found this,

"Volunteers for the Nursing Service of the VAD had to be at least 21 years old for home service and 23 for service overseas and of a maximum age of 42 for those overseas and 48 at home."

Source - https://www.militaria-history.co.uk/...id-detachment/

Terry

Terry thank you for this. As you know there were four sisters and the photo shows all of them in uniform. The youngest I've not been able to find any record in the BRCS history site and she was not born until 1899 so would have been to young at the time of the photograph, maybe she was in one of her sisters old uniforms or..... I did find however a name that is very close but registered in another county. I don't think I will find out any conclusive proof.
Peter

[mike_vee]

Originally Posted by Gerryd

I have a photo now of all four sisters in either VAD or Fany uniform dated around 1918 August I would guess)

Originally Posted by Gerryd

As you know there were four sisters and the photo shows all of them in uniform. The youngest I've not been able to find any record in the BRCS history site and she was not born until 1899 so would have been to young at the time of the photograph, maybe she was in one of her sisters old uniforms

Is it possible that the photo was taken later , possibly early 1920 , when all four sisters were 'reunited' ? A momento of the youngest one joining the nursing service, I don't think she would wear one of her sisters uniform .

If the three older sisters were serving overseas or even in UK VAD hospitals it may have been difficult to get all four together for a photo.

Some FANY units served in France until 1919 and the card you showed in post #9 indicates one sister's termination date from VAD as 21/3/19.

From FANY website :
"In January 1918 a group of FANYs was sent to drive for the Michelham Convalescent Home in the south of France. They served there until 1919."

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[Home Guard]

The youngest sister, is definitely wearing a VAD style head covering. I have read this handkerchief style scarf was implemented because the previous head cover looked too much like a QA. Her dress looks to be white, which is contrary to that of a VAD though, as they typically wore either light blue or gray depending if they were BRCS or SJA. Perhaps a specific hospital nurses aid?

Terry

[Gerryd]

Originally Posted by mike_vee

Is it possible that the photo was taken later , possibly early 1920 , when all four sisters were 'reunited' ? A momento of the youngest one joining the nursing service, I don't think she would wear one of her sisters uniform .

If the three older sisters were serving overseas or even in UK VAD hospitals it may have been difficult to get all four together for a photo.

Some FANY units served in France until 1919 and the card you showed in post #9 indicates one sister's termination date from VAD as 21/3/19.

From FANY website :
"In January 1918 a group of FANYs was sent to drive for the Michelham Convalescent Home in the south of France. They served there until 1919."

.

The eldest sister Olga(nurse uniform) died from pneumonia in Jan of 1920 she caught this while transporting patients.

The watch lady Marjorie was married in July 1918 which would be on her first leave after 6 months with FANY corp., she gave birth to a daughter in early 1920.

Jane the other FANY didn't start her tour of duty until late July or early August 1918 so would have been in England then. I'm not sure where the picture was taken but if were in Altrincham for Marjorie's wedding it would make sense that everybody would have been local.
It could of course be later I will ask the granddaughter if there is any inscription on the back.

Peter

[Home Guard]

Yep, my mistake. Thought we were talking about the one in the nurses uniform. Sorry about that.

Terry

[Gerryd]

There seems to be some confusion.

From left to right
Jane, Nancy ,Olga and Marjorie

Majorie born 1888 died 1956
Jane born 1892 died 1965
Olga 1894 died from pneumonia 1920
Nancy born 1899 died 1926

[mike_vee]

Originally Posted by Home Guard

Thought we were talking about the one in the nurses uniform.

I thought the same thing , so now we know it's not her and two of the others are wearing FANY uniforms .

That leaves one but whose uniform/cap badge is she wearing , St.John Ambulance ?

Also she appears to have a white (?) stripe on her arm.

" From May 1916, VADs employed in home hospitals under the direction of the Joint War Committee were allowed to wear a white horizontal stripe on each sleeve of their work dress, four inches below the shoulder, to indicate that they had served continuously for a period of at least thirteen months.The white stripe acknowledged length of service but was not a recommendation as to capability or competence."


Thread from GWF :

Are these girls VAD nurses?


PS. Also found another site that may be of interest.

http://www.fairestforce.co.uk/5.html


.

[Gerryd]

Originally Posted by mike_vee

I thought the same thing , so now we know it's not her and two of the others are wearing FANY uniforms .

That leaves one but whose uniform/cap badge is she wearing , St.John Ambulance ?

Also she appears to have a white (?) stripe on her arm.

" From May 1916, VADs employed in home hospitals under the direction of the Joint War Committee were allowed to wear a white horizontal stripe on each sleeve of their work dress, four inches below the shoulder, to indicate that they had served continuously for a period of at least thirteen months.The white stripe acknowledged length of service but was not a recommendation as to capability or competence."


Thread from GWF :

Are these girls VAD nurses?


PS. Also found another site that may be of interest.

http://www.fairestforce.co.uk/5.html


.

Mike thanks for your reply the two links were informative.
I’ve been looking in the wrong place for Nancy, the youngest sister, as I thought she was BRCS.
I can’t find a birth date exactly but she was baptised in Jan of 1900 and I don’t think they hung about in those days to get the children baptised as infant mortality was high. With this in mind I think she would have been born late 1899 and therefore too young to belong to either St John or BRCS volunteer units but I suspect she could have been a member of the St John organisation.
I see she has the stripe on her arm, was that awarded only for VAD work?

The photograph could be later but if I’m right and its around July 1918 for Marjorie’s wedding, or as you suggested later, lets say mid 1919 when both the FANY sisters had finished their term abroad she would officially still be too young to have gained that stripe for 13 months continuous service.
Personally I think she changed her date of birth to fit the situation I doubt there were many checks as the boy soldiers are testament to?
I will maybe today to see if I can find any more information but I don’t hold out much hope.

Peter

[mike_vee]

Originally Posted by Home Guard

"Volunteers for the Nursing Service of the VAD had to be at least 21 years old for home service and 23 for service overseas and of a maximum age of 42 for those overseas and 48 at home."

Regarding minimum age , I found a post on GWF that may be relevent :

"They were set during wartime for nursing VAD members as 21 to 48 for home service, and 23 to 42 for overseas service, with a lower age limit of 19 for General Service VADs. "

.

[mike_vee]

Originally Posted by Gerryd

With this in mind I think she would have been born late 1899 and therefore too young to belong to either St John or BRCS volunteer units but I suspect she could have been a member of the St John organisation.

Personally I think she changed her date of birth to fit the situation I doubt there were many checks as the boy soldiers are testament to?

Possibly she was a St.John or BRCS member and when 'volunteers' were urgently needed for "home hospitals" she added a year (or two) to her age , if the minimum age for General Service VADs was 19 I sure by 1917 she could have pulled it off.

So , in theory , she could have 'earned' her white stripe in mid/late 1918 which would fit with the timeframe of the photo. From what I've read , the white stripe was initially for those employed in "home hospitals" and was possibly given to all staff not just VAD nurses .


.

[Milmed]

Nancy and Olga are both wearing BRCS uniforms. Nancy in outdoor service dress and Olga in ward dress

[Gerryd]

Originally Posted by Milmed

Nancy and Olga are both wearing BRCS uniforms. Nancy in outdoor service dress and Olga in ward dress

Milmed Its pretty obvious to anyone reading my posts I'm no expert but I thought Nancy has a St John badge in her cap?
Peter

[The Quartermaster]

I have seen this technique used before where a photographer of that time takes four pre-existing portrait photos and combines them in such a way by re-photographing them to create a new photo which could never have actually been taken as a group. This enables the family to send to friends a photo showing how the sisters served and did their duty. I have a similar composite photo dated 1903 of three sailors who drowned on HMS Waterwitch, posed together but the give away are the cap tallies which reflect service in earlier ships. Cheers Mike,
Www.qmsmilitaria.com

[Milmed]

Originally Posted by Gerryd

Milmed Its pretty obvious to anyone reading my posts I'm no expert but I thought Nancy has a St John badge in her cap?
Peter

Hi Peter, definitely a Red Cross cap badge... see same badge in post #15 of this thread

Regards
Steven

[The Quartermaster]

And if you needed further proof that it is a composite group photo note the lighting of the faces which is inconsistent for a photo taken in a single sitting
Cheers
Mike
Www.qmsmilitaria.com