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  #1  
Old 08-02-10, 07:19 AM
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Default KOSB in aa ?

Hi. Can anyone tell me if the Regular Battalions of the KOSB ever wore the "staybrite" version of their badge ? and if so, was it worn on the glengarry ? and during what period would this have been ? Sorry to pose so many questions in one thread, but I would very much like to know. Regards. Jeff
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  #2  
Old 08-02-10, 08:15 AM
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Jeff,

They did indeed wear the a/a badge after 1968 when the Brigade system broke up until the formation of the Royal Regiment of Scotland. They wore it in all head dress.

Alan
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  #3  
Old 09-02-10, 08:16 AM
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Thanks Alan, thats very interesting. So I guess there was no KC aa ?? Regards Jeff
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  #4  
Old 09-02-10, 08:35 AM
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Hagwalther will know for sure but I don't think so.
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  #5  
Old 09-02-10, 12:03 PM
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Jeff

the following may be of interest from The Bulletin of The Military Historical Society vol XIX no 76 of May 1969. It allows one to get some idea on the dates of wear of (what I assume are) A/A versions of regimental badges.

From the Honorary Secretary's notes.

Regimental Badges. For those who may have missed the announcement, it was reported in the Press in early March that eight infantry regiments are to resume the use of their regimental cap-badges, in place of the Brigade badges prescribed in 1958. The eight are: Royal Scots, Green Howards, Cheshires, Royal Welsh Fusiliers, King's Own Scottish Borderers, Duke of Wellingtons Regt., Black Watch and Gordon Highlanders...

Although it does not mention the type of badge I assume that from 1969 it was the A/A version of the badge that was issued.

Others may know if the AA version was worn prior to the introduction & adoption of the Brigade badge.

John
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  #6  
Old 09-02-10, 02:58 PM
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Default KOSB in aa

Here are some notes I've made on this badge previously:

KOSB D&E

WO32/20561.

13.02.66. Director of Army Contracts wrote to Q(C&S)2a. A number of badge manufacturing tenders had been put out but no manufacturer had taken them up.
Mention of Glasgow Highlanders badge being difficult on account of the need for two-colour anodising and detail required. Due to the small number of the badges required manufacturers were reluctant to make dies, tools etc.

11.03.66. AQMG wrote to COD Branston & others regarding outstanding AA badges:
CB No--- Pattern-- Unit-------------- Demands-- Stocks-- Date last ordered
3506 14755 UOTC Birmingham 72 pairs 199 pairs 1953
3528 17481 Staffs Yeo 212 pairs 120 pairs 1954
3547 17554 North Irish Horse 142 pairs 113 pairs 1956
3750 17226 North'ld Hussars 100 pairs 50 pairs 1953
3206 16518 HAC(Arty) AA Large 137 singles Nil Unknown
7955 17345 Badges, Tam-O-Shanter Glasgow Highlanders
362 singles 750 (War Reserve) 1942
3327 16968 KOSB 312 singles 5390 (Inc 1500 War Reserve) 1955

With the exception of HAC & Glasgow Highlanders small stocks of GM insignia were held, and if issue were to be agreed, would suffice until the TA reorganisation.
Dies existed for the outstanding HAC & KOSB badges.

11.05.66. QMGF2 made the following observations,
UOTC Birmingham- to use up metal stock before purchasing AA.
Staffs Yeo- Requested 100 pairs seemed excessive as only the Regimental Band was entitled to collar badges at public expense.
North Irish Horse- Requested 142 pairs seemed excessive as only the Regimental Band was entitled to collar badges at public expense.
Northumberland Hussars- Stock of GM/WM badges to be used up and position reviewed in 12 months.
HAC- Authority granted, reluctantly, to purchase 137 badges @ 12/6d each.
Glasgow Highlanders- The unit should use up existing stocks, including the War Reserve.
KOSB- The unit should use up existing stocks, including the War Reserve. The current stock equalled 35 years supply.

There is also a forum photo of Sealed Pattern AA badges Organisation Tam-O’Shanter KOSB.
Sealed 26.03.71. Old Patern No 210194 deleted. (Superseded 26.04.94.?)
NSN 8455-99-973-9926.
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  #7  
Old 09-02-10, 03:03 PM
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'3327 16968 KOSB 312 singles 5390 (Inc 1500 War Reserve) 1955'

These are collars but the actual cap badge does not seem to have been made in a/a until well after 1968. Presumably as the sealed card shows old metal k/c stocks were used up until then.
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  #8  
Old 09-02-10, 08:43 PM
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Gulp ! Wow ! Argghhh !! This is almost too much for my poor brain to take in ! Thanks very much to everyone for all your kind help. Sincerely. Jeff
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  #9  
Old 09-02-10, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Mc William View Post
Thanks Alan, thats very interesting. So I guess there was no KC aa ?? Regards Jeff
Im sure that Hagwalther had an image of the KOSB a/a badges with reference to the smaller badge that was worn in the sporran.

Also ,im sure that it says that there was a kc KOSB in Peter Taylors book.Ive never seen an example or heard of one.Peter would be probaly able to say where the information on that one came from.
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  #10  
Old 09-02-10, 09:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike H View Post
Im sure that Hagwalther had an image of the KOSB a/a badges with reference to the smaller badge that was worn in the sporran.

Also ,im sure that it says that there was a kc KOSB in Peter Taylors book.Ive never seen an example or heard of one.Peter would be probaly able to say where the information on that one came from.
here is the link to Hagwalther's KOSB Card from the IWM.

It shows a KC White Metal cap badge in 1970

http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/for...tish+borderers
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  #11  
Old 10-02-10, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike H View Post
Im sure that Hagwalther had an image of the KOSB a/a badges with reference to the smaller badge that was worn in the sporran.

Also ,im sure that it says that there was a kc KOSB in Peter Taylors book.Ive never seen an example or heard of one.Peter would be probaly able to say where the information on that one came from.
I think his book might need some revision for the next edition.
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  #12  
Old 10-02-10, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grey_green_acorn View Post
here is the link to Hagwalther's KOSB Card from the IWM.

It shows a KC White Metal cap badge in 1970

http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/for...tish+borderers
Thanks for the link GGA. A very interesting thread indeed, but oh dear this has opened a real "can of worms" for me ! Can I return a little later to discuss this after I have done some "homework" ? Regards. Jeff
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  #13  
Old 10-02-10, 02:37 PM
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Hello folks,

While my Royal Scots Fusilier badges are in doubt, I also dropped on this link by Jeff, in fact, I've sent Jeff a PM because I don't particularly want to make myself look a D-head again, although I seem to be doing it all the time.

The point of this query is a quote by Alan that I found while following the link in the above post :-

[Chris,

Great piece of work. It also puts to bed the idea that WM Q/C KOSB badges are anything other than commercially sold badges. If they were still wearing k/c bonnet badges with the q/c sporran then the later q/c bonnet badges ones would also be in a/a.

Some regts did go from k/c metal to metal q/c and then a/a q/c but not the KOSB.

Alan ]

Having read the statement by Alan, I took my EIIR W/M badge off the board and put it with my bits and pieces for re-sale but just to be on the safe side I had a quick look through Bloomers and found this.......see photo, so which is it ?

Is the EIIR crowned white metal badge just a commercial badge or was it ever worn, too many expert opinions for my tiny brain to take in, me thinks !!

Regards.

Dave.
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  #14  
Old 10-02-10, 03:47 PM
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I think this takes us around again to the question of metal badges sold "commercially" by the PRI (President of the Regimental Institute) to soldiers and worn by them with obvious CO and RSM approval. Collectors need to decide if they are only going to collect badges as "issued" by the Quartermaster or if they will also collect badges actually worn by soldiers!
Bear in mind that until fairly recently most officer's badges were privately purchased by the officer from the Regimentally approved civilian tailor. They are (particularly OSD bronze from WW1 and WW2) therefore "commercial" and not "issued".
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  #15  
Old 10-02-10, 04:18 PM
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Hi g_g_a,

What's wrong with ' genuine ' as opposed to ' copy/restrike ', for example, if until recently, Officers' badges were bought privately, what was the official alternative ?

Also, if the EIIR crowned, white metal version of the KOSB badge wasn't officially issued, why has Bloomers included it in their book ( as shown in my previous thread ), quote " O/R's present day, QC, wm " unquote ?? just two questions that come to mind.

Dave.
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