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  #1  
Old 11-01-19, 03:20 AM
kingsley kingsley is offline
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Default Cut down artillery helmet plates

Just seen the really great photo in the NZ section of NZ volunteers wearing cut down HPs.
Apparently several Australian colonies wore cut down HPs as well, probably as an economy measure. The Tasmanian Torpedo Corps (Engineers) wore it in the 1890s (see photo) and there is another illustrated in Grebert's book (Page 263) of the WA Pinjarra Mounted Corps.
What I would like to know is whether the scanned Victorian arty HP was officially cut down and worn by some other part of the Victorian colonial forces apart from the artillery?? I have been considering trying to find the bottom part of a standard British HP (gun and scroll) and restoring it.
Maybe I should leave it as it is?
I understand that Victoria wore HPs with both the standard RA motto (as per scan, also Grebert page 170) and also the Victorian "Äust Pace aut Bello" motto as in attached scans from the Bob Gray collection.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg TasEngineers3.jpg (60.0 KB, 34 views)
File Type: jpg vichpB.jpg (62.8 KB, 31 views)
File Type: jpg bobśVicArty.jpg (55.9 KB, 25 views)
File Type: jpg VicArtyHPbook2.jpg (99.1 KB, 18 views)
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  #2  
Old 11-01-19, 07:51 AM
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hi kingsley
interesting question? never thought they would have worn cut down plates. wonder what Cossum says about this?
anyway, i would be interested to hear the answers/thoughts also.
i would also like to hear if any UK regiments did it but i doubt that??
here is a volunteer NEWCASTLE on Tyne cut down plate.
oh and my officers Victoria artillery HP
cheers
bc
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File Type: jpg IMG_8233.jpg (99.7 KB, 16 views)
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  #3  
Old 11-01-19, 09:34 AM
Lancer 17 Lancer 17 is online now
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Hi BC

Ive just checked book 2 of Cossum which starts at 1900 and therefore doesn't cover Pre Fed badges. Theres nothing like it.

Having moved house 2 years ago I still cant find my folder of Vic pre fed Arty photos but I don't remember there being any of this type of Helmet Plate, all the officers wore a large Star type of white metal plate on a cloth helmet with a spike.

Kingsley Im still following my other enquiries and will get back to you.

Regards

Phil.
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  #4  
Old 11-01-19, 09:36 AM
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fairlie63 fairlie63 is offline
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I feel sure that when the Southern Tasmanian Volunteer Artillery helmet plates were withdrawn in 1883 and replaced by the generic Local Forces plate, they were then cut down for issue to the Tasmanian Engineers, who subsequently became the Tasmanian Torpedo Corps.

This would explain why the STVA plates are so rare, but the STA plates from 1887 onwards are reasonably common.

Keith
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  #5  
Old 11-01-19, 11:10 AM
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hi phil
cossom is working on a pre fed book and has been for several years.
the full gilt HP that i show is the officers pattern circa 1875.
actually, this HP came from Cossum

hey Keith
what you say makes total sense. i always wondered why the STVA plates are so rare

bc




Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancer 17 View Post
Hi BC

Ive just checked book 2 of Cossum which starts at 1900 and therefore doesn't cover Pre Fed badges. Theres nothing like it.

Having moved house 2 years ago I still cant find my folder of Vic pre fed Arty photos but I don't remember there being any of this type of Helmet Plate, all the officers wore a large Star type of white metal plate on a cloth helmet with a spike.

Kingsley Im still following my other enquiries and will get back to you.

Regards

Phil.
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  #6  
Old 11-01-19, 11:35 AM
Lancer 17 Lancer 17 is online now
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Hey BC

Whilst I don't want to be rude but Jeff is supposed to have been working on the Pre Fed book for at least 20 years. Id be at the head of the queue to get one.

Lets just keep hoping, Im happy to contribute if necessary.

Heres hoping

Phil.
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  #7  
Old 11-01-19, 11:50 AM
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hi phil
your not being rude. we are all waiting for the book.
ive actually seen the workings of it and it is fantastic.
jeff is trying to be a perfectionist. i dont think it will ever get published
i have some pics of some of the pages somewhere. will try and find them
bc
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  #8  
Old 11-01-19, 12:34 PM
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from the display at the shrine in melbourne
bc
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  #9  
Old 11-01-19, 07:41 PM
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I would be very surprised if Jeff is with us much longer and I wouldn't hold my breath for his book. It would have been fantastic but life has taken its toll on him and I don't think it is proceeding at any great rate.

Keith
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  #10  
Old 12-01-19, 12:40 AM
kingsley kingsley is offline
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Thanks for all the comments. I think I would be well advised in the short term to leave my cut down Vic HP as it is.
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  #11  
Old 12-01-19, 01:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badgecollector View Post
from the display at the shrine in melbourne
bc
Hi Kingsley

This one probably belongs to my friend JM's friend DJ. I will confirm and advise in due course.

Regards Phil.
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  #12  
Old 12-01-19, 01:27 AM
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hi kingsley
interesting to note that from all the pics i have of the Gray collection, i didnt see any cut down plates
bc
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  #13  
Old 13-01-19, 03:34 AM
kingsley kingsley is offline
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Quite right, not in my memory of seeing his collection or in any of my photos. I would not read too much into it, he would not have recognised the royal arms as an Australian HP.
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