Irish Badges - British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

CDodd · #1 30-04-08, 07:20 PM

I have attached the images of two Irish badges which I have picked up over the years and I haven't a clue what either is from. The first is a very old looking almost hand made badge no crown on it so I don't think it is British perhaps Irish American I do however believe that it is a military badge. The second is a small harp with a crown on it. Any information would be great.

John Mulcahy · #2 30-04-08, 07:34 PM

I have no clue what the top one is, the bottom at first glance appears to the the badge worn by the London Irish Rifles in the "pork pie" cap.

I shall chEck my notes later. If it is LIR it shall be a nice find as it is an un-common badge.

John

Peter Brydon · #3 30-04-08, 08:01 PM

This is off topic ,but is if it is Connor who started this thread, welcome to the Forum.

If it is not Connor welcome anyway

Peter

sixroadends · #4 30-04-08, 09:28 PM

My intial guess at the bottom one would be a Royal Irish Constabulary Collar Dog. My reason for this is the Shape of the Crown is more similar to me than the the London Irish where the front of the Gaelic Harp is more full. I am looking into it

sixroadends · #5 30-04-08, 09:41 PM

Here is another possibilty, still Royal Irish Constabulary, but wearing a Pork Pie type hat John spoke about. picture to small to tell, but crown/harp proportion looks a little different.

If no one else has definate answer send an email to the Police Museum of the PSNI at museum@psni.police.uk

That is the route I would follow if nobody else pipes in, maybe John will come through.

Kevin

John Mulcahy · #6 01-05-08, 01:38 AM

Kevin

you may be on the right road. It is not the LIR badge, have a look at the attached image the badge I thought it might be is centre bottom, and although similiar the LIR version has only 3 strings and they are voided.

John

sixroadends · #7 01-05-08, 04:27 AM

Want a wild suggestion on the Maid of Erin (the top Badge)? I have looked at the U.S. civil was insignia of the time and a couple of things spring to mind. (1) the badge is far too crude to be a military issued badge. The Badges of the U.S. civil war have far more definition and show the bare breasts of the maid. (2) as with British Badges the Maid faces the other way, which would make it either a reverse collar badge which doesn't seem to ever have been issued in the U.S. army as the used the standard U.S., C.S.A. collars.

Using the facing of the Maid of Erin I took a look back to when it ever was faced that way, which leads me to my wild suggestion. As far as I can tell and remember from various museums there is one event that were flags etc had the maid of Erin facing that way which was the 1798 Rebellion. This might account for the crudeness of the badge as it looks very "artizan" to say the least and covers the modesty of the Maid which matches the flags of the period from my memory.

So do you have a rebellion item or a badge some kid made in metal working class? I don't know, but I would look into it. P.S. I said it was a wild idea boys so don't slate me. lol

Eddie Parks · #8 01-05-08, 09:30 AM

It doesnt look like an RIC badge to me. I used to collect them and I can't remember anything in or out of my collection that looked exactly like this. It does have a vague resemblence to a Victorian RIC officers cap badge but it's too squat and too small.

However I could well be wrong!

Eddie

#9 01-05-08, 10:22 AM

Hello,
I dont have any of my RIC stuff to hand to check but did the RIC not start to wear collar badges until after 1902.

CDodd · #10 01-05-08, 10:45 AM

Many thanks for all the replies on the badges, we seem to be in a limbo between RIC and LIR ! To add to what I put in the earlier description I can say that the lugs (I think that is the name of them) on the back are quite long, longer than I have seen before so perhaps it is a collar badge. As for the first badge many thanks for the reply sixroadends, to be honest I thought rebellion when I first got the item but them dismissed it as wishfull thinking !!! The item looks old to me, very crude but it does have those lugs at the back for putting on a cap or something, I would love to find out what it is. By the way I doubt this will help anyone but the badges both came form the same source, a gift along with a NSW Irish Rifles badge and a Canadian Irish badge. As I said I amn´t really a badge collector so If anyone wants to know anything more about the badges that they cannot see on the photos please just ask. Thanks again for all the replies what a great forum !

Templar · #11 01-05-08, 10:46 AM

That top badge looks like something I saw with regards to one of the Irish Regiments in the U.S. Civil War. Just can't remember what regiment, or what web site.

Templar · #12 01-05-08, 11:09 AM

Since it came with other Canadian items, Any possibility it has a connection to the Fenian Raids?

CDodd · #13 01-05-08, 11:15 AM

Thanks for the reply it was just a general military collector from the US that gave it to me so I am not sure if the badges had any connection prior to him getting them. It could be that it is just a once of item and I will never get to the bottom of where it came from because I have nothing to compare it against ! Hopefully not though I have had it for about 6 or 7 years now and it has always bugged me as to where it came from.

Stanley_C_Jenkins · #14 01-05-08, 06:25 PM

The second badge has a crown on top of it so it cannot be anything to do with the Americans or The Fenians!

PeterMc · #15 01-05-08, 09:15 PM

Conor; the harp & crown badge is not RIC, whatever else it might be. The 'handmade' harp badge may well remain a mystery but as you probably know many things like this were produced during the 'Celtic Revival' years and often for local political campaigns. I have something very similar in respect of the metal and manufacture which is actually a cycling club badge of the 1900-1912 period.