1837 Peacock - British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

jfenzy1 · #1 14-09-20, 06:50 AM

Hi,
A large button. A peacock beneath a Queen Victoria Crown ? The reverse reads P&S Firmin 153 Strand...which I believe gives it a specific date of 1837. Looking at Livery buttons Identified website, the Manners (Links and Leics) crest is the closest I can find, but the body and stance of the peacock are totally different and none stand beneath a crown. Would anybody be able to shed some more light ? Opinions welcome.

High Wood · #2 14-09-20, 07:08 AM

The clue is in the crown, more specifically the type of crown, as they indicate the social rank of the family whose crest is on the button. Once you have identified the social rank you can narrow the field considerably.

Scroll down to the Commonwealth usage section.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crown_...eraldic_crowns

On your button the peacock seems to be standing on the cap (I forget the correct heraldic term) of a Baron. The crown itself does not appear to confirm to a specific pattern.

High Wood · #3 14-09-20, 07:35 AM

Here is the entry of the Manners family taken from a 1857 dated copy of Burke's Peerage.

If your button does belong to a member of the Manner's family, it is possible that the crown was added to signify a marriage with another aristocratic family creating a new branch of the family. It is also possible that it is an entirely different family.

You really need to find an expert in heraldic devices who understands it far more than I do.

Whereas, I need to find a more up to date copy of Burke's peerage.

btns · #4 14-09-20, 08:03 AM

A slightly earlier button maker (R.Bushby) produced an identical button.
It is in the book "Livery Buttons" by Gwen Squire as "Manners, Duke of Rutland".

High Wood · #5 14-09-20, 08:25 AM

You are correct, as I look at the original button I can now see that it is a Ducal Crown/ Coronet above the peacock.

The button would have belonged to the branch of the Manners family that was the Duke's direct lineage, whereas the button illustrated on the Livery buttons site is that of a branch of the Manners family that were not heirs to the Dukedom.

jfenzy1 · #6 14-09-20, 08:44 AM

A closer look at the crown.

jfenzy1 · #7 14-09-20, 09:01 AM

I could listen to you guys all day, certainly an interesting learning curve for me. Buttons have never really been my thing, but learning what this signifies and what family it belongs to is fascinating. Thank you for your time and effort guys, this button thrown in a bag with a host of others and tucked away in a cupboard for years, now has an identity.
Kind regards, Jim.