Colin Owen book

[davidwyke]

Hi

I recently purchased a copy of the book "The Military Badges And Insignia Of Southern Africa" (Colin R. Owen), only 25 years after it was published! What a fantastic reference book.

Reading the introduction it would appear that all the badges shown in the book are from the author's collection (some of the badges having being added to his collection specifically to be included in the book). Out of curiosity, does anyone know if the collection is still intact or has it since been broken up?

David

[rhodesianmilitaria]

It was sold years ago. Some privately and other bits on the net where he set up a site to sell it.
It's a pretty good book but from a Rhodesian collectors perspective there is a lot that isn't in it.

[davidwyke]

Hi Peter

Thanks for that. There may be a lot of Rhodesian items "missing" but he still had a superb collection.

I also have the Cranston & Rhodes book which includes a lot of additional Rhodesian insignia. Haven't got the recently published 2nd volume yet but there are probably further items in that.

David

[rhodesianmilitaria]

Originally Posted by davidwyke

Hi Peter

Thanks for that. There may be a lot of Rhodesian items "missing" but he still had a superb collection.

I also have the Cranston & Rhodes book which includes a lot of additional Rhodesian insignia. Haven't got the recently published 2nd volume yet but there are probably further items in that.

David

Interesting. What is the title of the book?

[davidwyke]

It's "British Colonial Badges - Military Insignia Of The Land Forces Of The Colonies, Protectorates And Dependencies" by Barry Renfrew, Margaret Renfrew & Bill Cranston. (I said "Rhodes" in my previous post, that's what you get with talking about Rhodesia!).

The original volume was published about 3 years ago and a second volume was published a few months ago, haven't seen vol 11 yet.

David

[rhodesianmilitaria]

Ok thanks. I'd never heard of it. Most of what I collect isn't shown in books in detail and certainly some of the history of the items is incorrect and I've proven that with original photos. Hard to say when something is no longer being worn when I can produce a photo showing that it was some 5 years later.

[Frank Kelley]

Certainly not a good reference book, merely, an illustrated catalogue of a single collection.

Originally Posted by davidwyke

Hi

I recently purchased a copy of the book "The Military Badges And Insignia Of Southern Africa" (Colin R. Owen), only 25 years after it was published! What a fantastic reference book.

Reading the introduction it would appear that all the badges shown in the book are from the author's collection (some of the badges having being added to his collection specifically to be included in the book). Out of curiosity, does anyone know if the collection is still intact or has it since been broken up?

David

[rhodesianmilitaria]

Been many years since I bought a reference book so I can't speak for all of them. However to me a good reference book would have to include reverse photos of the badges, patches, wings or whatever the items were.
The photos would have to be closeup, taken to show as close as possible to the correct colours and also so show the attachment/s, hallmarks, stitching, type of backings etc.
Example see photo.
I don't know if there are any books like that, there certainly aren't in what I collect. One then has to ask if in today's climate of so much copying whether anyone would do that.
I certainly wouldn't show publicly the reverse of the para wings in my collection or the various stampings on the reverse of Selous Scouts officers badges.

IMG_1889.jpg

[davidwyke]

I appreciate the above points. To me, though, it's a good reference book in the sense that you can refer to it, for example in order to identify what a particular badge is. There are numerous badges shown which would be difficult to ID as to unit without such a reference, unless you are an expert on SA insignia, which I'm certainly not!

Obviously some reference books are more detailed and comprehensive than others but If you refer to a book for information, whatever that info may be, then that's what I would term a reference book. Whatever you want to call it, though, I still think it's a good book and I wish I had bought a copy years ago!

David

[fougasse1940]

If there is a better book on Southern African badges than Owen I'd very much like to hear about it.

Rgds, Thomas.

[John L]

Originally Posted by fougasse1940

If there is a better book on Southern African badges than Owen I'd very much like to hear about it.

Rgds, Thomas.

I don't if it is better but Border War Badges by [form member] Andrew Dinnes is very good. There is a link in the form members books

John

[rhodesianmilitaria]

Originally Posted by fougasse1940

If there is a better book on Southern African badges than Owen I'd very much like to hear about it.

Rgds, Thomas.

Originally Posted by rhodesianmilitaria

It's a pretty good book but from a Rhodesian collectors perspective there is a lot that isn't in it.

Part of what I said in my first post on this thread.

I don't collect South African items or other Southern African countries items so it might be the best reference book on earth for those countries.

From a Rhodesian collectors point of view it's good when you first start collecting but depending on what you collect then there is a lot missing. However there is no definitive reference book for Rhodesian militaria that I know of and probably never will be. Dudley Walls book was very good but all these books are really only the author's collections just like Frank Kelley has stated.

In this book of Owen's:
Most para wings missing.
Most AD wings missing.
PJI brevets missing.
No explanation of the differences in variations.
No explanation of the differences in stampings (hallmarks) of the officer's and OR's Selous Scouts, RLI, RAR and Greys Scouts badges.
No explanation of when Reuteler Manufacturing started making badges.
No real explanation on a number of badges and a number of the dates they were worn imo are incorrect.

As I have said it is a good book when starting out but in the field that I collect it is seriously lacking but hey I have a copy and every year I might look at something in it.

[Alex Rice]

Originally Posted by rhodesianmilitaria

However to me a good reference book would have to include reverse photos of the badges, patches, wings or whatever the items were.
The photos would have to be closeup, taken to show as close as possible to the correct colours and also so show the attachment/s, hallmarks, stitching, type of backings etc.
Example see photo.
I don't know if there are any books like that, there certainly aren't in what I collect. One then has to ask if in today's climate of so much copying whether anyone would do that.
I certainly wouldn't show publicly the reverse of the para wings in my collection or the various stampings on the reverse of Selous Scouts officers badges.

Attachment 124934

Unfortunately you had hit the dilemma nail on the head. If you go into too much detail with reference works, it'll just open the floodgates for fakers and the whole collecting game would be ruined. The realistic method would be to get and accurate book with quality pictures and then share on a forum like this. To me, collecting is to try and get the best collection I can and I'm not interested in 'one-upmanship'. I try to help other serious collectors if I can.
Cheers,
Alex

[Anthony03]

I don't think that is quite true Frank ! - I contributed a number of photos of rare badges to his book and I know that many were supplied by Sam Foote and a number of other collectors. You will see some of them (my name Alf Boyley) in the acknowledgment section of the book

[Alex Rice]

Originally Posted by Anthony03

I don't think that is quite true Frank ! - I contributed a number of photos of rare badges to his book and I know that many were supplied by Sam Foote and a number of other collectors. You will see some of them (my name Alf Boyley) in the acknowledgment section of the book

Hi Alf
Interesting to note that some of your (and other collectors) badges are in Colin's book. I was under the impression, and I think that his book is commonly thought to only have badges from his collection. Good to know there were other contributors.
Cheers,
Alex