Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders - British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

Luke H · #1 07-10-21, 09:44 PM

Can anyone confirm who would’ve worn this type of Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders badge please?

It appears to be silver plate which has seen some wear to the front. The centre piece and thistle wreath are very intricately voided. I can’t see any marks sadly but it’s a solid quality badge.

My thoughts were it was perhaps NCOs but someone has since told me it may be officers?

Please note I will likely be moving this item on as it doesn’t fit with my collection.

Fatherofthree · #2 07-10-21, 10:05 PM

A very nice badge.

However I can't assist with your question.

Regards.

Brian

cbuehler · #3 08-10-21, 01:28 AM

It looks to be a standard OR badge that was hand fretted and then silver plated. Not the norm, but a very nice badge as mentioned. A custom job by some bored soldier who was skilled with his hands? Who knows?

CB

leigh kitchen · #4 08-10-21, 04:28 AM

The top "point" has been removed, a feature found on A&SH badges converted for wear as belt lockets.
I'm thinking this badge, whatever it's purpose was adapted for civilian use, perhaps for a child's costume or female adult headgear?
And after I type all that and post, I see the top point isn't actually missing, it's just a bit bent.......

Luke H · #5 08-10-21, 05:28 AM

As you say Leigh the tip isn’t missing just bent over.

The fretwork has certainly not been done by a bored soldier. Also the colour is GM where the plate is worn away so it’s not a standard ORs badge as they weren’t made from GM.

It’s a heavier thicker stamping than all the ORs badges I have. I should have said I’ve a heavy die stamped badge in just normal WM which was sold as an NCOs badge. Almost identical to item Code: 60218 on https://www.qmsmilitaria.com/ , where it’s listed as a Sergeants badge.

A very similar one here. https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/fo...ad.php?t=52663 Nothing suggests to me these are converted for children’s costumes or wear in women’s hats.

leigh kitchen · #6 08-10-21, 08:45 AM

Agreed that it's not adapted for the wife or kid to wear, that thought was based on my mistake re. the health and safety aspect.

magpie · #7 08-10-21, 09:04 AM

May be a cheap officer's badge, pretty sure it would have looked impressive wearing it's silver plate.

leigh kitchen · #8 08-10-21, 10:03 AM

Not much help, "Bloomer's" (Scottish Regimental Badges 1793-1971) shows a similarly voided badge but in white metal simply as OR's 1900-59 (it doesn't state that the centre of the badge is raised so presumably it isn't as a white metal version with "conventional" voiding is noted as having a raised centre).

grey_green_acorn · #9 08-10-21, 10:17 AM

I was told many years ago by veteran A&SH soldier that the raised centre was created by hammering using a piece of wood like the rounded end of a broom handle with the badge on the rim of a milk bottle.

Tim

cbuehler · #10 08-10-21, 02:40 PM

I don't think this badge is a sweetheart or such either. The fretting looks hand done judging by the photo which I magnified, edges on the reverse show some rough edges from the process. I really think it was done after the badge was made. Of course this badge could well have been worn by an officer, but also an OR for a fancy walking out badge or a retired Gael to wear as a civilian as well. As for the GM base metal, only some restrikes/fakes were made of this metal to my knowledge.

CB

Borderer · #11 08-10-21, 03:48 PM

Hi Luke,

OR's badge which has been fretted, not by a board soldier, we do not have any

I would say it has been done by a local craftsman, found where ever the British Army are stationed overseas, I have a similar KOSB badge which was fretted I believe in Cairo, its a bit more intricate as he has done the regiments title and the lower motto, normally the lower motto fretted were Sergeants badges.

On the pushing out of the centre this is a normal practice by soldiers, I for one did it to my own KOSB cap badge, not long after the rebadging parade on 17th July 1969, pushing out the castle by placing it over the open top of a milk bottle and tapping down with a top of a broom handle which was prefect for the job with acceptable results

Nice badge by the way.

Best
Hiram

leigh kitchen · #12 08-10-21, 03:58 PM

I wore a police chromed metal cap badge which I molested with a small hammer and a piece of wood so that its "ERII" voided centre was domed, and I backed it with a small piece of black velvet rather than show the blue/black and white Stilleto Tartan cap band through the voiding.
It drew comments from colleagues who noticed it - along the lines of "looks like a pimple that's about to explode" but I stuck with it.

Some A & SH badges have domed centres which don't appear to be squaddie's modifications but manufactured that way.

tonyb · #13 08-10-21, 05:24 PM

A domed example I've had for a few years,.
I've read the solid centre variant is Victorian.
Tony.

Alan O · #14 08-10-21, 05:40 PM

I have read that the domed centre was a favourite of the 2nd bn. The fretted badge is a modification and not an NCOs' badge per se. It's an affectation rather than a sealed pattern.

Luke H · #15 09-10-21, 07:21 AM

The chap who runs A1 Militaria has told me this is ‘definitely’ a SNCO badge and an early one with the tail still up.

As I said I’m 100% sure it’s been manufactured this way not modified by local craftsmen - again it’s GM underneath and I know of a great many SP badges which are on a GM/brass base.

And I struggle to believe a ranker could turn up on parade with a silver plate badge with officers style voiding. I suspect he wouldn’t get much affection from his Sergeant or the rest of his company from the consequences of being ‘special’.

If NCOs wear / wore higher quality badges than ORs, which I’m sure most will accept they did, then this does seem to fit the bill.