British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

Recent Books by Forum Members

   

Go Back   British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum > British Military Insignia > Infantry (& Guards) Badges

 Other Pages: Galleries, Links etc.
Glossary  Books by Forum Members     Canadian Pre 1914    CEF    CEF Badge Inscriptions   Canadian post 1920     Canadian post 1953     British Cavalry Badges     Makers' Marks    Pipers' Badges  Canadian Cloth Titles  Books  SEARCH
 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #61  
Old 12-04-08, 03:23 PM
41st's Avatar
41st 41st is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Cardiff, Wales
Posts: 2,093
Default Smaller Version RWF Badge


Toby,
This is the smaller version badge which I have and referred to earlier in this thread. Shown for comparison against an economy all brass version.
I have no idea what it may have been used for or whether it is a fantasy item.
Cofion,
Kevin
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 014 - Copy.jpg (44.9 KB, 111 views)
File Type: jpg 016.jpg (76.2 KB, 62 views)
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 13-04-08, 04:26 PM
Toby Purcell's Avatar
Toby Purcell Toby Purcell is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Completed colour service and retired
Posts: 3,209
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 41st View Post
Toby,
This is the smaller version badge which I have and referred to earlier in this thread. Shown for comparison against an economy all brass version.
I have no idea what it may have been used for or whether it is a fantasy item.
Cofion,
Kevin
That's it. Only the second one I have ever seen (and I have first!). Thank you so much Kevin. Long slider, back and size clinches it. No way a fantasy item and must have been for a short-lived head dress of some kind I reckon. Perhaps ORs early (all Navy Blue) Field Service Cap C 1893. Perhaps we can research it?

Last edited by Toby Purcell; 13-04-08 at 06:40 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 13-04-08, 05:44 PM
41st's Avatar
41st 41st is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Cardiff, Wales
Posts: 2,093
Default


Toby,
Will give the research a go. Having put forward the possibility of it being a fantasy item, come to think of it I've never seen another.
Hwyl,
Kevin
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 13-04-08, 06:44 PM
Toby Purcell's Avatar
Toby Purcell Toby Purcell is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Completed colour service and retired
Posts: 3,209
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 41st View Post
Toby,
Will give the research a go. Having put forward the possibility of it being a fantasy item, come to think of it I've never seen another.
Hwyl,
Kevin
I don't think fantasy as the badge is too well made with a clear military style to it. The 'Welsh' spelling dates it unequivocally and its size indicates to me that it was for a special head dress. As there appear to be so few surviving (but must be more than 2 don't you think?) I reckon it was for a short lived head dress. The 2 that spring to mind are the Field Service Cap (1893-1902) and the Brodrick Cap (1902-1906).

Last edited by Toby Purcell; 13-04-08 at 09:24 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 13-04-08, 06:52 PM
Toby Purcell's Avatar
Toby Purcell Toby Purcell is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Completed colour service and retired
Posts: 3,209
Default

These are 3 corporals of RWF circa 1904 (l to r, Tunic with jam pot cuff, Blue Patrol (private purchase only) and 'Home' Frock (in plain red with no piping)). Check out the man standing centre rear and the badge on his FSC (held in hands). Notice it is 'set in' at the slant, as was common for grenades in that style of head dress. Could this be our badge?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg post-894-1208098798.jpg (62.0 KB, 45 views)

Last edited by Toby Purcell; 13-04-08 at 09:25 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 14-04-08, 09:08 AM
Bantam's Avatar
Bantam Bantam is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Redditch,Worcs
Posts: 655
Default

Hi Both,
I know I said I was leaving forum but I couldn't look on and not help my mates.I am sure the badge is a fantasy badge.I have expressed my views to 41st in the past regarding the badge.I base it on the fact that during mid 80's there was a glut of this badge abounding the Arms Fairs I attended so much so I did not purchase one because my collecter friends at that time were in agreement they were faked.
I do not know the reason why but I have not seen them for sale since then.
If you pm me I can let you have more info.
Bantam
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 14-04-08, 12:43 PM
Toby Purcell's Avatar
Toby Purcell Toby Purcell is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Completed colour service and retired
Posts: 3,209
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bantam View Post
Hi Both,
I know I said I was leaving forum but I couldn't look on and not help my mates.I am sure the badge is a fantasy badge.I have expressed my views to 41st in the past regarding the badge.I base it on the fact that during mid 80's there was a glut of this badge abounding the Arms Fairs I attended so much so I did not purchase one because my collecter friends at that time were in agreement they were faked.
I do not know the reason why but I have not seen them for sale since then.
If you pm me I can let you have more info.
Bantam
Thanks Bantam, I didn't know you were leaving the forum and am sorry to hear it. I have PM you but it will take incontrovertible evidence for me to be convinced of the 'fantasy badge' theory. My regiment did not deal in 'fantasies' and would have rooted such a thing out long ago. I saw a lot of fake, all brass economy issues too in the 1980s, but this badge is not like that and is of very good quality. Also compare the size of the ORs badge in the photo above with their collar badges.

Last edited by Toby Purcell; 14-04-08 at 01:27 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 09-08-13, 09:55 PM
JerryBB's Avatar
JerryBB JerryBB is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Wales
Posts: 5,149
Default

A shame so many of the pictures from this thread are missing, though I assume as mentioned that member Bantam left the forum and deleted his images when he left, or were they deleted in some other way?
__________________
Regards,

Jerry
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 12-06-14, 05:44 PM
41st's Avatar
41st 41st is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Cardiff, Wales
Posts: 2,093
Default

I do hope that it is no-one on here that has put a bid in on this heap of junk;-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3214251826...84.m1423.l2649

The real ones are shown earlier in this thread.

I bought one of the eBay copies a few years back cheaply just to have a look, horrid.

Hwyl,

Kevin
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 12-06-14, 05:49 PM
GriffMJ's Avatar
GriffMJ GriffMJ is offline
LYPAO Boff
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Caerlŷr, yn Lloegr.
Posts: 6,445
Default

Kevin

An addition to the "Bodill and Parker" makers mark section...... good or bad it should be included for reference
__________________
Cofion gorau
Gruffydd M-J
www.paoyeomanry.org.uk

"A Yeoman from the Stalwart Rural Cavalry"
Lechyd da pob Cymro
Reply With Quote
  #71  
Old 12-06-14, 06:00 PM
41st's Avatar
41st 41st is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Cardiff, Wales
Posts: 2,093
Default

Nothing wrong with the seller btw. I had a great item from her.
I don't think she is aware that this is a copy.

Griff,

I don't care much for the WH example shown in the mm section.

Cofion gynnes,

Kevin

Last edited by 41st; 12-06-14 at 06:08 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Old 12-06-14, 06:35 PM
JerryBB's Avatar
JerryBB JerryBB is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Wales
Posts: 5,149
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 41st View Post
Nothing wrong with the seller btw. I had a great item from her.
I don't think she is aware that this is a copy.

Griff,

I don't care much for the WH example shown in the mm section.

Cofion gynnes,

Kevin
Seller had a lot of RWF items recently, a few I bid on and did not get. The RWFus Collar converted to a cap badge looked very interesting.

I did not bid on the B&P 1st VB badge, just looked wrong to me.
__________________
Regards,

Jerry
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Old 12-06-14, 06:39 PM
GriffMJ's Avatar
GriffMJ GriffMJ is offline
LYPAO Boff
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Caerlŷr, yn Lloegr.
Posts: 6,445
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 41st View Post
Nothing wrong with the seller btw. I had a great item from her.
I don't think she is aware that this is a copy.

Griff,

I don't care much for the WH example shown in the mm section.

Cofion gynnes,

Kevin
Kevin

I didnt know if it was good or bad..... but its there for reference. Maybe Mike can "Suspect" or "Blatent Fake" tag them?
__________________
Cofion gorau
Gruffydd M-J
www.paoyeomanry.org.uk

"A Yeoman from the Stalwart Rural Cavalry"
Lechyd da pob Cymro
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 12-06-14, 09:26 PM
41st's Avatar
41st 41st is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Cardiff, Wales
Posts: 2,093
Default

Griff,

Blatant fake.

Jerry,

Do. Count yourself lucky. The only half decent badge in that lot was the standard issue post 20 RWF and possibly the re-shanked WG. Amazed someone chucked £69 at it.

I've not seen the supposed ST correctly identified yet, but you could see where the lugs had been cut off & ground down.

Total waste.

There have been some absolute gems on recently though. I picked up a 16th Welsh collar for £11.33 amongst others and it's rather heart warming to see a good Glam Imp Yeo go for £122 when you have a few. UCW Aber OTC for £92.

Good Welsh badges do appear to be going up. Time to hone your knowledge bechgen.

Hwyl fawr,

Kevin


Last edited by 41st; 13-06-14 at 06:34 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 12-06-14, 09:40 PM
JerryBB's Avatar
JerryBB JerryBB is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Wales
Posts: 5,149
Default

I thought that type of collar (in this case with an added slider) was thought to be of Indian make and was a desirable type?

As always, I am trying to improve my knowledge. As you state the post 1920's RWF or's was clearly a good one, the WG I did not really look at and the other two were obvious duffers even to me.

It was the sergeants ab64 (paybook) that most interested me, but it went beyond what I expected it to go for.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 41st View Post
Griff,

Blatant fake.

Jerry,

Do. Count yourself lucky. The only half decent badge in that lot was the standard issue post 20 RWF and possibly the re-shanked WG. Amazed someone chucked £69 at it.

I've not seen the supposed collar correctly identified yet, but you could see where the lugs had been cut off & ground down.

Total waste.

There have been some absolute gems on recently though. I picked up a 16th Welsh collar for £11.33 amongst others and it's rather heart warming to see a good Glam Imp Yeo go for £122 when you have a few. UCW Aber OTC for £92.

Good Welsh badges do appear to be going up. Time to hone your knowledge bechgen.

Hwyl fawr,

Kevin

__________________
Regards,

Jerry
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

mhs link

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:43 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.