Ques; 7th Dragoon Gaurds and 8th Reg of Foot

[Collects Badges]

Hi Guys

I have a couple of questions and hope you can help me.

I have two separately issued pay/account books that I am trying to match up with the appropriate Cap Accoutrement/Helmet Plate for display.

The first is for a soldier who enlisted with the 7th Dragoon Guards on May 31st 1827. Most of his service was at Fort Beaufort, Cape of Good Hope. Going thru our own gallery (search for 7th Dragoon Guards) , would he have been issued a Helmet Plate something like the 1847 pattern posted there i.e. something similar to KK708? and would he have been awarded the South Africa Medal, 1834 - 1853?

The second account book is for a soldier who enlisted with the 1/8 Regiment of Foot on Feb-7th-1866. The majority of his service was in India, 1868 to 1878. Would his Badge have been that illustrated as KK 129A? and would he have been awarded the India General Service medal, 1854 - 1895?

Any and all help on these questions would be greatly appreciated.

thanks,

Al R

[Collects Badges]

Anyone, anything to add or comment?

thanks,

Al R

[Paul Spellman]

Hi Al,
With regard to the 8th of foot, going by the dates your man most likely wore the Last Shako and plate and the Glengarry, I don't have a last Shako plate but if you view Peter Brydon's Kings Liverpool Regt album he has an example of both.
Paul
Ref the IGSM, you would need any record available to see what clasps he was entitled too.

[Collects Badges]

H Paul

thanks for looking at my post and the helpful information. I did a search in our gallery for Peter Brydon's album but could not seem to find it. There was some similar album's i.e the 5th Kings Liverpool Regt.

Will also check the IGSM to see what he was awarded.

thanks, Al

[Alex Rice]

If you have the soldiers' service numbers you might be able to download their service records from 'Forces War Records' or National Archive sites.

[davidwyke]

Hi

A few thoughts re your queries.

1/8th Foot - if he served in India with them from 1868-1878 I don't think he would have qualified for the IGS medal, unless he was on attachment to another unit. I don't think they saw any campaign service during that period which would hve earned them the medal. (Peter will shout at me if I'm wrong about that!).

7 Drag Gds - the only info I have re them being stationed at Fort Beaufort is for the period 1843-1848, don't know if your man was still serving then?

If he was, they saw campaign service against the Boers in 1845 but there was no medal award for this. They then fought in the 2nd (or 7th) Kaffir War of 1846-1847, if he took part in this campaign he should have qualified for the SA Medal. I have the medal roll for this so if you want to provide his name then I can check the roll. Bad news is that you will have to let me know today or tomorrow at the latest as I won't be on the Forum for a while after that.

While at Fort Beaufort during the above period they wore the 1834 Pattern brass helmet & plate. On campaign against the Boers they are believed to have worn the same helmet minus the bearskin crest. However, during the Kaffir War they wore a blue forage cap with yellow band - don't think this would have had a badge.

Hope this helps!

David

[Collects Badges]

Hi Alex and David

thanks for looking at my post and for the additional information, you guys have been a big help. Here is the additional information for the two soldiers;

correction for James Ward, served in India from 1868 to 1876 (not 1878).

1.) No. 1529 Corporal James Ward of C Company.
Account book no 1529 (his Regiment No.) (printed in the year 1865)
1/8th Regiment of Foot
Enlisted for the 8th Regiment of Foot on 7th February 1866 at Dublin in or near the town of Birmingham, in the County of Warwick, 23 years of age, Church of England, trade or calling – Fitter. Education - In possession of 3rd class school certificate.
Soldiers no. 1529

Postings:
- Station: Dublin, England, 1866, 18-Mar-1866 to Dec-31-1866
Landed at Malta 20 March 1866,
- pay book dated Station; Malta; 1867, 1868, Jan-31-1867 to Dec-31 -1868
Landed in Bombay 3rd November 1868
- Station; Dune (sp?) 1869, Jan31-1869 to Dec-31-1869
- Station; Trusserabad East India, 1870, Jan-31-1870 to Dec-31-1870.
- Station; Nussierabad, 1871, Jan-31-1871 to Dec-31-1871
- Station; Caronpore, 1872 to 1873, Jan-31-1872 to Dec-31-1873.
- Station; Chuckratta, 1874, 31-Jan-1874 to 30-Nov-1874
- Station; Chakratta, 1875, 31-Jan-1875 to 26-Nov-1875
- Station, Nittany, 1876, 22-Jan-1876
Was promoted to Corporal in 1867.

Summary:
Enlisted at Dublin, England in Feb-7th 1866, with the 8th Regiment of Foot, at 23 years of age.
Was promoted to Corporal in 1867.
Stationed in Malta from 1866 to 1868.
Stationed in India from 1868 to 1876.
Approx. 10 years of service with the 1/8 Foot Regiment (according to this pay book).


2.) Philip H. Morrell, No. 296

Enlisted for the 7th Regiment of Dragoon Guards on May 31st, 1827, at the age of 22 yrs, 11 months.
1st January 1831 - Promoted to Corporal,
1st Jul 1834 promoted to Sargent,
6th April 1843, promoted to Hosp’l Sargent.
By Capt. W. Bambick

Postings:
1843 to 1849 – Fort Beaufort, Cape of Good Hope
1849 to 1850 – Brigham
1851 – Norrbridge
1852 – Dublin
1853 – Ballincolly

Summary:
Therefore 26 yrs of service from date of enlistment in 1827 to last posting in Ballincolly in 1853.
Note: It is Ballincolly where he was married 16th April (?) 1834.




Hope this helps and I appreciate any help you can gave me.

best regards,

Al R

[Collects Badges]

here's a couple pictures of James Ward and Philip H.Morrell's account books:

[davidwyke]

Hi Al

South Africa (1853) Medal Roll for 7th Dragoon Guards shows SERGEANT PHILIP H. MORRELL as entitled to the medal. Qualification is service in the 2nd Kaffir War.

He was probably discharged to pension so it's possible that his service papers still exist. He may also have been awarded a Long Service & Good Conduct Medal, worth checking on both these.

David

[Collects Badges]

Hi David

Thank you for the additional information on Morrell, you have been a tremendous help. I will also try to download his service papers as Alex suggested.

best regards,

Al