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  #1  
Old 17-02-19, 07:59 PM
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Default 4th/5th Battalion Royal Irish Rangers (V)

Hi Guys,

Does anyone have the cap badge, in its original packaging, of:

4th/5th Battalion Royal Irish Rangers (V)

The NSN is 8455-99-130-3697 and pattern No. is 30197.

Regards,

Chris
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  #2  
Old 18-02-19, 01:33 PM
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Chris,
Sorry can't help with the badge in its original packaging but here are two extracts from JSP768. The first from the early 2000s, the second from the 2005 edition repeated again in the 2010 edition.

It appears that the NSN and Pattern No that you seek is/was the Officers badge in nickel, gilt and silver or rhodium plated. This was worn by Officers in the (regular) Royal Irish Rangers from its formation in 1968 until 1992. It was also worn by officers in the TA 4th (NIM) and 5th (V) Royal Irish Rangers Battalions from 1971 until 1993 when they became 4th/5th (V) Battalion Royal Irish Rangers (4/5 RANGERS) retitled in 1999 to "The Royal Irish Rangers" (RANGERS). In 2007 they were retitled again as 2nd Battalion The Royal Irish Regiment (2 R IRISH) adopting the badges of the regular battalion.

However, the second JSP768 extract from 2005 indicates that the anodised version of the badge is/was obsolescent so the assumption is that the officers badge became "all ranks" and could have been worn by all ranks from circa 2004 until 2007, assuming stocks of the anodised badge had been exhausted. Quite a short period which may explain its scarcity?

Tim
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 4 5 RANGERS 2001.jpg (52.2 KB, 31 views)
File Type: jpg 4 5 RANGERS.jpg (48.8 KB, 25 views)
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  #3  
Old 18-02-19, 06:14 PM
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I have two:-

1. Firmin square clear bag. FIRMIN & SONS PLC.
NSN:8455991279224. Patt No. 19870. Dated 1/11/04.
The cap badge itself is marked 'F&S' behind the crown.

2. Toye Kenning & Spencer 'clip bag', bearing:-
NSN 8455991279224 DofQ EA on a white sticky label.
The badge is marked 'toye.com' behind the scroll.

There are several makers of this badge bearing a variety of makers marks, including a stubby north and south lugged belt plate badge.

Oddly I have an all gold and an all silver example of this badge, no doubt errors. However I do also have an all silver example with north and south clutch pins.

All the above mentioned are anodised aluminium.

Bess
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  #4  
Old 18-02-19, 06:52 PM
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Thanks Tim,

The badge I am interested in was issued before 1993 to the Royal Irish Rangers and if I remember, deleted from the inventory in 2012. It was also carried over into the 'New Metal' era in 1993 when the spec to the manufacture of badges to 'New Metal' changed. A few other unit badges were also carried over in 1993 but I have always managed to find such examples in post 1993 packaging.

I have been recently told that many officers actually used the A/A version or purchased a silver/gilt one from PRI sources. In fact many soldiers did the same - this back in 1992. Cost was GBP30 which is quite a sum - solidiers and officers were wearing the same badges both issue A/A and expensive PRI pieces.

I was also told by an ex serving officer of the 4/5 RANGERS an issue piece was made to him (and other officers in his company) in 1984 as an officer in 2 R IRISH (Rangers) and he carried it with him to 4/5 RANGERS. Past 1984 though the trail to find new issues of this badge goes cold.

Bess, you had me quite excited for a moment and then I realised you were talking about the A/A version!

So, if anyone has any non A/A badges in their original packets even if dated before 1993 I would be very interested to see them.

Regards,

Chris
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  #5  
Old 18-02-19, 07:27 PM
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Chris,
ah, yes, sorry about that! Before 1993, its likely to be packaged in:-

1. Just wrapped in tissue, sealed with yellowing cellotape.
2. Heavy gauge plastic, heat sealed (or stapled) pouch with a sticky typed label (the print looking like its from an early word processor. No makers markings just the NSN
usually.
3. Small square grease proof paper pouch with a folded over flap, either stapled or wrapped with a small rubber band (usually perished by now).
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  #6  
Old 18-02-19, 07:30 PM
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Chris,
This picture is of a card available from the Royal Irish Regiment PRI shop http://www.royal-irish.com/shop

Interesting that it seems to show a 'new metal' type Rangers cap badge with a slider. As far as I know all the anodised Rangers cap badges had lugs and were worn with a hackle.

Tim
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File Type: jpeg image.jpeg (105.9 KB, 37 views)
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  #7  
Old 18-02-19, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grey_green_acorn View Post
Chris,
This picture is of a card available from the Royal Irish Regiment PRI shop http://www.royal-irish.com/shop

Interesting that it seems to show a 'new metal' type Rangers cap badge with a slider. As far as I know all the anodised Rangers cap badges had lugs and were worn with a hackle.

Tim
Hi Tim,

They will be A/A existing stock or PRI modern.

The badge I'm researching was authorised with lugs.

I'm told the PRI also had RUC and Royal Irish Regt piper badges made for commercial sale.

Regards,

Chris
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  #8  
Old 18-02-19, 09:22 PM
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Chris

I think I have already shown you these but will add to this thread just in case you need the pics. Both are Gilt & Silver, one possibly Rhodium. The poorer quality one being maker marked Firmin to the rear.

Paddy
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  #9  
Old 19-02-19, 01:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy View Post
Chris

I think I have already shown you these but will add to this thread just in case you need the pics. Both are Gilt & Silver, one possibly Rhodium. The poorer quality one being maker marked Firmin to the rear.

Paddy
Thanks Paddy,

It seems the first without maker mark is official issue but from the mid 1980's. I have this one too. The second one probably from the 1980's as well. I have some images of a third variant which I am trying to enhance re: die flaws etc. but it seems marked FIRMIN to rear of crown. Mounted parts are held in place by bent pins with the pin covering the middle of FIRMIN if indeed it is marked as such.

I have a feeling that all official officers 4th/5th Battalion Royal Irish Rangers (V) cap badges are pre 1993 but I have a few more leads to cover yet. Still no sign of a post 1993 dated packet (or any packet) examples yet which is unfortunate.

Regards,

Chris
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  #10  
Old 19-02-19, 11:27 AM
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Default Royal Irish Rangers

Have an example of the crown and scroll overlay, held in place with pins. No makers mark.
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File Type: jpg 15505753447111912310149.jpg (67.5 KB, 18 views)
File Type: jpg 1550575449151-1244427162.jpg (61.6 KB, 22 views)
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  #11  
Old 19-02-19, 06:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishhorse View Post
Have an example of the crown and scroll overlay, held in place with pins. No makers mark.
Hi Irish Horse,

Thanks for the images - do you remember where you got it from - in a packet perhaps?

Regards,

Chris
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  #12  
Old 19-02-19, 07:17 PM
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Got it from a collector many year ago. No packet.
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  #13  
Old 19-02-19, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishhorse View Post
Got it from a collector many year ago. No packet.
Thanks!

I'm putting some infor together on these badges and when I have more details I'll post here.

The elusive packeted example either pre and post 1993 still eludes me!

Regards,

Chris
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  #14  
Old 19-02-19, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grey_green_acorn View Post
Interesting that it seems to show a 'new metal' type Rangers cap badge with a slider. As far as I know all the anodised Rangers cap badges had lugs and were worn with a hackle.

Tim
Youre right Tim,never seen an a/a Rangers badge with a slider.
The North Irish Brigade was slidered as was the UDR and the early issues of Royal Irish regt badges
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