British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

Recent Books by Forum Members

   

Go Back   British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum > Everything Else > Civilian Services: Police, Prison Service, Fire Brigade, Merchant Navy, etc.

 Other Pages: Galleries, Links etc.
Glossary  Books by Forum Members     Canadian Pre 1914    CEF    CEF Badge Inscriptions   Canadian post 1920     Canadian post 1953     British Cavalry Badges     Makers' Marks    Pipers' Badges  Canadian Cloth Titles  Books  SEARCH
 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 24-04-14, 07:48 PM
ScrewLoose ScrewLoose is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 4
Default Prison cap badges.

Please can anyone help.

I've just started collecting prison cap badges, and I would like to find out how many are in the line up.

or where would I find this out.

Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 24-04-14, 08:46 PM
54Bty's Avatar
54Bty 54Bty is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: London, England
Posts: 6,287
Default

You could always give this a try;

http://www.prisonofficer.org.uk/view...php?f=2&t=1404
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 26-04-14, 07:29 PM
ScrewLoose ScrewLoose is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 4
Default

Thanks for your post, however i have tried and tried but it will not log me on.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 28-04-14, 01:43 PM
Bantam's Avatar
Bantam Bantam is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Redditch,Worcs
Posts: 644
Default

Hi ScrewLoose,
To be allowed access to http://www.prisonofficer.org.uk/view...php?f=2&t=1404 you first have to fit the required criteria set by the administrators to become a member and if suitable they will then grant you permission it is not an automatic process.
Regarding prison badges it depends how far back you want to start and do you want to collect all makers ? I'm afraid there aren't any books available on the subject to help either.There are a number of contributions on this site regarding various prison badges which should help you .
Besides metal badges there are also cloth,rank,specialist all in both metal and cloth available,what exactly are you hoping to achieve.
Bantam
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 28-04-14, 06:47 PM
ScrewLoose ScrewLoose is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 4
Default

Hi Bantam,

I was given a bag of items by a prison officer when he retired from the service. In the bag were two cap badges, which looked interesting and I decided to the collect cap badge of the prison service since then.

Over the past few months i have managed to collect a total of 7 badges, with the earliest ones being George 6th and Edward 8th, other badges include guilt staybrite and enamel, but now I cannot seem to find any that I dont have.

I am just looking to complete the cap badges collection first before moving into other area's.

Thanks

Screwloose.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 28-04-14, 08:50 PM
altcar73 altcar73 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Formby, Merseyside
Posts: 1,969
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScrewLoose View Post
Hi Bantam,

I was given a bag of items by a prison officer when he retired from the service. In the bag were two cap badges, which looked interesting and I decided to the collect cap badge of the prison service since then.

Over the past few months i have managed to collect a total of 7 badges, with the earliest ones being George 6th and Edward 8th, other badges include guilt staybrite and enamel, but now I cannot seem to find any that I dont have.

I am just looking to complete the cap badges collection first before moving into other area's.

Thanks

Screwloose.
Sounds as if you have those that are readily available, there are one or two others which you will struggle to find, if at all. You may be surprised to hear that the EVIIIR version is not uncommon.

Dave.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 29-04-14, 12:53 PM
Bantam's Avatar
Bantam Bantam is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Redditch,Worcs
Posts: 644
Default

Hi Screwloose,
I must agree with Dave it would appear that you have most of selection available but even the Q/C W/M version there is a very slight difference in the different manufacturers striking's they are J Gaunt. London Badge & Button Co, Dowler, Firmin and unnamed.
There is also a gilt version of the last pattern of the star version that was never issued produced by the London Badge & Button Co. one of which was sold on E-Bay last week and sold for £46.99.
How are you managing with the female versions.
Bantam
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 30-05-14, 11:42 AM
Pauljailer's Avatar
Pauljailer Pauljailer is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Warrington, Cheshire, England
Posts: 5
Default Female HMP cap badges

He will struggle with the older female cap badges Bantam - because YOU have them!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 31-05-14, 01:55 PM
ScrewLoose ScrewLoose is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 4
Default

Thank you for your posts,

Thanks for the info, i do have two female badges, the so called current star pattern still sealed, and the previous white metal badge, given to me just recently but I haven't looked into collecting these yet.

The gilt star badge is that rare, as not issued and is £46 a good price. most of my stuff has been given or has cost a couple of pounds.

Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-07-14, 12:07 AM
Jamesb853 Jamesb853 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 86
Default Prison cap badges

Regarding the EVIIIR cap badge, it is evident that many examples of this badge show signs of use, and I would suggest the following scenario: although it was normal not to change badges until after a coronation, the EVIIIR badges were commissioned and struck prior to the abdication crisis, and some issued, perhaps first to those officers on ceremonial duties, e.g. attending Assizes as escorts. Following the abdication it would have taken some time for the GVIR version to be approved and produced; in the meantime the EVIIIR type continued in general use until the new type could be distributed. It seems there must have been a change of uniform type in 1936, perhaps following from the Home Office regulations for police uniforms from 1934, which would explain the absence of a GVR version of this badge.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 11-07-14, 01:26 PM
Jamesb853 Jamesb853 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 86
Default Prison badges

On the subject of the EIIR badges, it would be interesting to know the date when brass was replaced with chrome, and where the staybrite badges fit into the sequence. When I was working in the Crown Courts in the 70's and 80's the prison officers on duty there wore chrome insignia, and the star pattern cap badge certainly first appeared in 1988, along with the new style shoulder titles. The attached illustration shows a female officer on duty at the Central Criminal Court in 1977 and as you can see, she is wearing an HMNP shoulder title on her lapel.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Female prison officer 1977001.jpg (72.8 KB, 106 views)
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 18-07-14, 06:01 PM
Bantam's Avatar
Bantam Bantam is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Redditch,Worcs
Posts: 644
Default

Hi Jamesb853,
Thank you for your input in raising the profile of prison insignia.The H.M.P. title worn by female staff on the jacket front was smaller then the shoulder titles.I've seen two versions of this badge and that the tighter design on the one would have been worn by the senior ranks i.e.Senior,Principle and Chief Officers.
I also recognise the female member of staff in your photo.
Hwyl,
Bantam
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 18-07-14, 06:08 PM
Bantam's Avatar
Bantam Bantam is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Redditch,Worcs
Posts: 644
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesb853 View Post
Regarding the EVIIIR cap badge, it is evident that many examples of this badge show signs of use, and I would suggest the following scenario: although it was normal not to change badges until after a coronation, the EVIIIR badges were commissioned and struck prior to the abdication crisis, and some issued, perhaps first to those officers on ceremonial duties, e.g. attending Assizes as escorts. Following the abdication it would have taken some time for the GVIR version to be approved and produced; in the meantime the EVIIIR type continued in general use until the new type could be distributed. It seems there must have been a change of uniform type in 1936, perhaps following from the Home Office regulations for police uniforms from 1934, which would explain the absence of a GVR version of this badge.
In reply to your post James a George V pattern was issued and differed from the Edward VII crown by being voided as opposed to non voided and slightly other differences in its design.
Regards,
Bantam
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 18-07-14, 11:56 PM
Jamesb853 Jamesb853 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 86
Default Prison cap badges

Hi, Bantum,
I think I may have the GvR version, which came from an old collection of prison related stuff. I will dig it out and post it for opinions. The GviR female staff badge strongly resembles what has traditionally been catalogued as a MPSC GVR badge, i.e. Royal cypher within a wreath with crown above. It seems that recent research has cast doubt on this attribution but has offered little convincing evidence for any alternatives. Could this be a HMP issue?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 19-07-14, 12:02 AM
Jamesb853 Jamesb853 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 86
Default Prison badges

Hi Bantam, forgot to say that the female officer looks quite an attractive lady!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

mhs link

All times are GMT. The time now is 02:16 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.