Fife and Forfar Yeomanry

[jim a]

So I went downstairs and dug up my fife and fofar badge.... Besides having a broken off slider (which I knew about)... it also seems to have a broken off plume... which i didn't even know was suppose to be there.... as for flowers... I can't see em.... looks like maybe a dud.... Jim

[Alan O]

A positively real one. WW Two era.

Alan

[Alan O]

close up picture. This one was collected by my grandfather so I know that it is genuine. While the reins are not voided, the horses legs are.

[Mike]

one of the restrikes (alleged) photographed for the "restrike database"* has the flowers on the base.

http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/ima...r_yeomanry.htm




*think that project fell into the 'too hard' basket.

[sean michael cronin]

Completely different striking of the flowers and no void in the knights head plume. I would not dismiss either of these badges as re-strikes, why would a copier make his task more difficult by adding flowers to his dye. All the best Sean.

[Mike]

Hi Sean, yes you are right different dies. The w/m slider badge was very soft though, and I assumed a true restrike out of original dies.


just a note regarding the separate linked page: it was an experiment to see what it might look like, should we have a go at trying to identify good from bad. So the page is only my opinion which is of course useless. The only way would be to vote on each badge or something and score each item, then let the viewer use the info as they see fit. - which is just too complex and difficult to do.

[signalman]

Could i please have some opinions on this Fife and Forfar Yeomanry badge. Regards.Phil.

[signalman]

Im not too good with the old 'puter's'.If the second image is too small i will enlarge.P.

Phil,
if the badge is in brass as it looks like on the pictures, then it is the cap badge of the 14th Battalion of the Fife & Forfar Yeomanry and dates back to WWI (WWII Fife & Forfar Yeomanry had a silver or white metal version). As for its authenticity, I'm no expert on the Fifes (but 2FFY on this forum is, contact him or wait for the badges experts' advices).
Chers
Phil

[dubaiguy]

As Phil says if brass it certainly looks like a 14th (Fife & Forfar Yeomanry) Battalion Black Watch badge (circa 1917 to 1919) from the photo.

Though it looks bent or squashed. The Horse upon which sits the Thane of Fife should be rearing with its front hooves completely clear of the ground by a good 3 or 4mm. Also I think the Thane's plume should fall more vertical on a 14th Bn badge than on your badge and be almost (but not quite) touching the Thane's shield arm.

Only a laymans observation of course.
Mark

[signalman]

Thank you Mark and Phil.It is brass as far as i can judge,and i take the point regarding the squashing.It is heavy on the front end,but as far as i can judge looks honest,thanks again.Regards.Phil.

[Alan O]

Can anyone provide evidence that the all brass version is the 14th Bn?

Dealers sell them as such because they are all-brass 1916 economy badges and in 1917 the F&F Yeo were the 14th bn. BUT there was NOT an economy version of this badge. This is another example of dealers' lies to over price a badge by linking it to an unsubstantiated period.

Alan

[Deejayuu]

Originally Posted by Alan O

Can anyone provide evidence that the all brass version is the 14th Bn?

Dealers sell them as such because they are all-brass 1916 economy badges and in 1917 the F&F Yeo were the 14th bn. BUT there was NOT an economy version of this badge. This is another example of dealers' lies to over price a badge by linking it to an unsubstantiated period.

Alan

There is a reference in Bloomers `Scottish regimental badges` figs 282, 283 & 284.

282- F&FY 1908-1956 in copper? Illustration shows a different style knight and horse. Not sure if this is specific to the badge or simply a manufacturers variation.
283- F&FY 1908 wm
284- 14th (F&FY) bn, Black Watch 1917-19 in brass
Cheers, Dave

[Viletone]

Originally Posted by Alan O

Can anyone provide evidence that the all brass version is the 14th Bn?

Dealers sell them as such because they are all-brass 1916 economy badges and in 1917 the F&F Yeo were the 14th bn. BUT there was NOT an economy version of this badge. This is another example of dealers' lies to over price a badge by linking it to an unsubstantiated period.

Alan

K&K don't mention a 14th TA Battalion of The Black Watch, however the F&FY badge is listed as whitemetal and gilding metal.

I've no doubt that g/m badges are genuine items, I've seen enough of them to be convinved but Alan is correct to question who they are attributed to as many Yeomanry badges came in a varity of metals.

[dubaiguy]

Alan you raise a good point. I believe the attached is a true 14th Bn badge. Please note it is a little different to the standard F&F badge variants in that the Knight's (Thane's) plumes fall almost vertically. The slider on this badge is unmarked as you would expect and has a distinct crease at the top.

The spaces between the horses rear legs as well as the space above the reins are solid.

I don't know if I have answered your thought provoking question, but I do believe this to be a genuine 14th Bn BW article which Phil and others may want to use for comparison.
Mark