South Lancashire - British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

jim a · #1 19-12-10, 01:34 PM

I picked this badge up during the year. I like it alot as I think it's got alot of character. The strike , patina , broken slider, the broken/nipped off reaired slider are all things I enjoy with this one. The other thing is the amount of sweatholes...7 I can see. My question is would there be one more sweathole under the slider repair? Just curious to see if there were 8. Thanks

jim a · #2 19-12-10, 01:36 PM

've misplaced my camera tripod somewhere so had to free hand the pictures... looks like they turned out O.K

REMEVMBEA1 · #3 19-12-10, 03:13 PM

I have a similar South Lancs but different sweat holes, and all rectangular.

iain · #4 12-02-11, 09:35 PM

I just spotted this glengarry and wondered what the members take on it would be i'm very iffy about it ,apparantly from the late fathers collection which i have no reason to doubt but...

Jeff Mc William · #5 13-02-11, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iain

I just spotted this glengarry and wondered what the members take on it would be i'm very iffy about it ,apparantly from the late fathers collection which i have no reason to doubt but...

Hi Iain. Thanks for the nice photos.
I am by no means an expert on fakes, restrikes, and repros but, I would say that your 82nd badge is probably a "repro" tho' not a fake.
The distinction being that fakes are meant to decieve. However,I believe these old PT glengarry badges were often reproduced for use by the bandsmen of various regiments as pouch badges. Hence the "closed-back" and the three lugs for fastening.
IMO I don't think the faker would bother with such details in order to dupe an unsuspecting collector (indeed, in this case it might just have the opposite effect !).
So, yes, I think a "genuine repro" (if there is such a definition) tho' not for the glengarry cap. Regards Jeff

iain · #6 16-02-11, 01:47 PM

Okay, thank you for your opinion Jeff, i did not know that bandsmen had used these badges on pouches which would explain the three lugs. iain

#7 16-02-11, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jim a

I picked this badge up during the year. I like it alot as I think it's got alot of character. The strike , patina , broken slider, the broken/nipped off reaired slider are all things I enjoy with this one. The other thing is the amount of sweatholes...7 I can see. My question is would there be one more sweathole under the slider repair? Just curious to see if there were 8. Thanks

Hello Jim,

Are sliders clipped this short normally an indication that a badge has been part of a 'hate a belt'?

I also note the worn-looking area around the 'T' in 'Egypt'... is this a worn/rubbed section or something else?

Egypt.JPG

Cheers,

Peter.

2747andy · #8 16-02-11, 03:07 PM

Peter,
clipped sliders are common and a sign of use in headdress of one form or another.. Many early slidered badges had quite long vertical shanks, which was fine for sliding behind a Pagri band but would, I imagine make them difficult to fit into some undress forms of headgear. I am sure it was for this reason that they were all shortened in length by the manufacturers only three years after their introduction as the standard fitting for British Military Cap Badges. With the introduction into service of the beret, even the shorter sliders would protrude below the wearers headband and were either clipper or folded back on themselves.

On a separate point and not directed at you Peter!

I am not sure where this awful term "Hate Belt" has come from, and in my opinion it is very inaccurate as most badge adorned belts were put together with affection or esteem rather than Hate! An awful term, can we call them something else. "Veterans Belt"... "Souvenir Belt"????

Andy

#9 16-02-11, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2747andy

On a separate point and not directed at you Peter!

I am not sure where this awful term "Hate Belt" has come from...

Funny you should pick up on this 'Hate Belt', term Andy. Only the other day I was speaking with a former officer of the KRRC (now in his 80s) and we were discussing this very matter.

I am sure those forum members who have served in the Army (or still do) will also possibly have heard this, but he was explaining to me that when leaving the barracks, soldiers would be required to remove their belts and leave them with the corporal (or whoever was on duty at the gate/guard room), one reason being that they would frequently be used as make-shift weapons during bar room brawls. How true this is I have no idea, but it certainly lends credence to the possible origin of the term.

Now as unpleasant as the wording may sound to some, this is without question a generally accepted term. I for one am not in the least bothered by its use, but you do open an interesting question as to how it came about. I'd be interested to know, but do not wish to hi-jack Jim's thread. Perhaps a matter for a new thread?

PJ

taffyevans46 · #10 25-09-11, 02:22 AM

Hi JIM I am new to this so please forgive any errors. I have an identical badge without repairs and yes it has 8 sweat holes.I believe it is out of the same die as it also has the fault at the end of Egypt and also the strange overall shape.(looking at the front the left hand leaves are deeper struck and quite upright whereas the right side ones are shallower and more outwardly curved).Kind regards Brian