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  #1  
Old 21-11-22, 11:33 PM
ukbrits ukbrits is offline
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Default Featherston Camp Trumpet band opinions please

Hi Gents,
I have a Featherston Camp badge which I need an opinion on it's authenticity please.
It does appear to be different from Geoffrey Oldham's badge in his booklet -
Military badges of New Zealand.
The voiding on the crown does appear to be completely different than the one in his book.
This one does seem to have 2 small holes for the voiding in the crown which makes me suspicious
I would like to know if it's a dud or a reunion piece or a genuine badge.
Many Thanks in advance
Colin
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File Type: jpg f2.jpg (67.1 KB, 49 views)
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  #2  
Old 22-11-22, 03:37 AM
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Hi Colin,
I think this is a modern fake.
Cheers,
John
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  #3  
Old 22-11-22, 07:57 AM
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atillathenunns atillathenunns is offline
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I am not so sure, it could be the badge has been chemically cleaned and just looks new.

I have pictures that show 3 different types of lugs used on the FCTB badges and am leaning to there being two variations.
The brass FCTB badges have a 957 RD number and the silver FCTB badges have a 958 RD number.

This is not my badge but looks similar to the one pictured.
IMG_2199.jpgIMG_2200.jpg
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  #4  
Old 22-11-22, 06:35 PM
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Here is my badge with loops for comparison. As Brent has said there are variations.
Cheers, John
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  #5  
Old 23-11-22, 10:30 AM
milcollectorblue milcollectorblue is offline
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Default RD Numbers

Hi John,
I've taken onboard what Brent mentioned and have tried 'exploding' the photos of your badge but am unable to see any RD Number on the reverse of the trumpet horn. Does it have one?
Also, your badge quite clearly shows what I'd describe as the correct void space on the crown whereas the badge Colin showed in his original post merely had what appears to be 2 small holes drilled in the crown. In part that is what led me to believe it was a copy when he and I discussed the badge. (Colin's badge did appear to have a RD number though, but I was unable to discern what it was).
All-in-all it's a bit of a minefield, especially when it comes to the uncommon (and therefore hard-to-find) badges .
Regards,
Lovat
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  #6  
Old 23-11-22, 11:16 AM
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atillathenunns atillathenunns is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by milcollectorblue View Post
Hi John,
I've taken onboard what Brent mentioned and have tried 'exploding' the photos of your badge but am unable to see any RD Number on the reverse of the trumpet horn. Does it have one?
Also, your badge quite clearly shows what I'd describe as the correct void space on the crown whereas the badge Colin showed in his original post merely had what appears to be 2 small holes drilled in the crown. In part that is what led me to believe it was a copy when he and I discussed the badge. (Colin's badge did appear to have a RD number though, but I was unable to discern what it was).
All-in-all it's a bit of a minefield, especially when it comes to the uncommon (and therefore hard-to-find) badges .
Regards,
Lovat
RD numbers on NZ Camp badges are important when it comes to understanding who designed them. However that being said, many original camp badges do not have RD numbers, and are poorly hand finished.
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  #7  
Old 23-11-22, 07:13 PM
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Hi Lovat,
My badge has no RD number that I can see.
Regards
John

Quote:
Originally Posted by milcollectorblue View Post
Hi John,
I've taken onboard what Brent mentioned and have tried 'exploding' the photos of your badge but am unable to see any RD Number on the reverse of the trumpet horn. Does it have one?
Also, your badge quite clearly shows what I'd describe as the correct void space on the crown whereas the badge Colin showed in his original post merely had what appears to be 2 small holes drilled in the crown. In part that is what led me to believe it was a copy when he and I discussed the badge. (Colin's badge did appear to have a RD number though, but I was unable to discern what it was).
All-in-all it's a bit of a minefield, especially when it comes to the uncommon (and therefore hard-to-find) badges .
Regards,
Lovat
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  #8  
Old 24-11-22, 07:29 AM
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atillathenunns atillathenunns is offline
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Heres my FCTB badge, sadly its lugs have been replaced.

Just out of interest, there was two Featherston camp bands, one brass band under Bandmaster Wicks, and the Trumpet Band which was made up of NZ Artillery and NZ Mounted Rifles under Trumpet Major Frederick Chegwin.

featherston camp trumpet band Bandsman 2009-06-21 002.jpg
featherston camp trumpet band Bandsman 2009-06-21 007.jpg
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  #9  
Old 25-11-22, 02:10 AM
omok1 omok1 is offline
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I would have no problems with this badge. As already discussed there are variations. I currently have two in my collection but have owned and sold two or three more over the years. My current ones have differences in the hand cut voiding. One has no voiding in the arch of the crown and other has not been voided either side of the scroll by the trumpet cords. I have had both loops (either brass or copper wire) and hexs like yours, and also the drilling of holes without further cutting out of a small area is rather common on NZ reinfs badges. As mentioned the RD number on this badge is also variable. I mean these guys were in business, had multiple employees and were there to make money. Quality varied greatly with the badges. Nice badge. Just the TCB, CMB and NZMR band badges to get now :-) Good luck
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  #10  
Old 27-11-22, 12:51 AM
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atillathenunns atillathenunns is offline
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As mentioned, it is all “a bit of a minefield” when it comes to Reinforcement/Home Service badges, and as Craig has so eloquently put it “these guys (camp jewellers) were in business, had multiple employees and were there to make money.”
Some camp jewellers, long after the end of WW1 continued to supply Reinforcement/Home Service badges for museums and collectors, which makes it almost impossible to separate the original wartime badges from the original post war copies and to a certain point modern copies.

In regards to the RD957 number on the brass FCTB badge and RD958 number on the silver FCTB badge, my records show these were both registered to Trumpet Major Frederick Charles Chegwin, Featherston Military Camp, on the 26th March 1917.

Trumpet Major Chegwin is pictured below with the Featherston Camp Trumpet band, seated front row center. On his left breast he wears the South Africa medal with 1901 clasp, and the Queen Victoria Diamond Jubilee medal, and I suspect the medal on the right breast is from his service with the Woolston and Christchurch Garrison Bands.

Chegwin served as a bugler with the NZ 5th Contingent rising to Trumpet Major. During WW1 he was employed by the Home-service Branch, NZEF, attached to HQ Featherston Camp in charge of training trumpeters and buglers.
Private Chegwin entered Tauherenikau camp on the 13th October 1915, he was promoted Trumpet Major on the 22nd December 1915.

Tauherenikau camp is known to have 3 Bands in November 1915, a brass band, a bugle band, and a trumpet band. The Trumpet band was the first of its kind in New Zealand due to Featherston camp being a mounted camp, as such it was entitled to a trumpet band, which was undoubtedly started by Chegwin. All bands were under the command/baton of Bandmaster A. J. Wicks, and the bugle and trumpet band which became Featherston Camp Trumpet Band were under Trumpet Major Chegwin.

The FCTB was comprised of both Reinforcements and Home Service personnel, so would have had an ever changing membership. It appears they were disbanded in December 1918, so the FCTB badge was only in use for 1 year and 9 months, and IMO it was likely only worn on the shoulder straps.

featherston camp trumpet band featherston%20camp%20band.jpg

DOMINION, VOLUME 10, ISSUE 2924, 9 NOVEMBER 1916, PAGE 6
featherston camp trumpet band Bandsman 1.JPG
featherston camp trumpet band Bandsman 2.JPG
featherston camp trumpet band Bandsman 3.JPG
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  #11  
Old 27-11-22, 06:34 PM
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Great research, Brent. Thanks for sharing.
Regards, John
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  #12  
Old 01-12-22, 07:36 PM
ukbrits ukbrits is offline
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Hi Gents,
Yes great research Brent and thanks to everyone for contributing on
this most interesting thread. The badge in qestion is available for sale if
any Forum members are interested in purchasing it.
Many Thanks
Colin
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