Pre-1890 Marksman Badges?

[HMS-Troutbridge]

I decided to start this thread after discussion with members on this forum including Bryan (RCN), I do hope you don't mind me quoting you here Bryan and sharing one of your photos.

It is understood that the first mention of Royal Navy marksman (or good shooting) badges appears in the 1890 uniform regulations with three grades, crossed muskets, star above; 1st class, crossed muskets; 2nd class and single musket; 3rd class.

The first image shows a badge which does not fit these regulations, displaying crossed muskets with a crown above and appears anachronous to the regulations anyway given the non-substantive rating badge which is the pre-1890 design for a Seaman Gunner Torpedoman 1st Class.

The second image can definitely be dated to pre-1890 and yet shows a badge with crossed muskets worn in the position of a marksman badge. The date is affirmed by Bryan, "The Photo was taken in Torquay. Now he left Sultan & the Med in May ‘83 & was at Excellent re-qualifying as SG1 & as an Instructor until Apl ‘84, then returned to the Med for the Soudan campaign, so it has to be sometime between those two dates."

His rating badge is also clearly pre-1885 design of a Seaman Gunner 1st Class which also confirms this range of dates.

So, basically, what are apparently marksman badges but worn prior to the known regulations of 1890. Does anyone have any thoughts or information on this?