Parachute Regiment

[jfenzy1]

Hi people,
The Parachute regiment...good or bad please ?
Regards,
Jim.

[gb64]

Originally Posted by jfenzy1

Hi people,
The Parachute regiment...good or bad please ?
Regards,
Jim.

Hello Jim, as far as I'm aware its bad one unfortunately.


Gerard

[JerryBB]

Jim,

It is a blobby fake

[jfenzy1]

Thank you Gerard and Jerry, I had my suspicions, thanks for confirming with your superior knowledge. Another one for my brimming duds pot.
Best regards,
Jim.

[elwe23]

Question guys: are any original slider ones were made and worn during WW2 ?
Cheers

[Luc]

Originally Posted by elwe23

are any original slider ones were made and worn during WW2 ?

No, only lugged examples.

[Arnhem Jim]

Hello Jim,
Several experts from the forum have provided extensive guidance on the regimental cap badge of the Parachute Regiment. Over time, and with their permission and encouragement, I've compiled an article incorporating their expertise on the subject. You may want to glance at the following;

http://arnhemjim.blogspot.com/2011/0...cap-badge.html


Best regards,
Arnhem Jim
Arizona Territory

[arrestingu]

My original gaunt example.

[tcrown]

Originally Posted by arrestingu

My original gaunt example.

I would say that your badge was likely struck with an original die made by Gaunt. This doesn’t mean it was originally issued to parachute forces.

A few facts:
- QC Parachute Regiment badges were introduced in Aug 1955 struck on base metals and equipped with lugs;
- Maroon berets with a backing pocket for the badge started to be issued in 1955;
- The ordnance issue-type anodised or ‘staybrite’ badge was adopted in the early 60s. These badges were produced either with lugs or slider;
- The ‘staybrite’ badge was not popular amongst parachute forces which created particularly in the 60s a strong demand for QC old pattern metal base privately purchased.

Can we imagine a shortage of QC metal badge in the 60s that would have led to large restrike/conversion of KC badges? It seems to me unlikely.

Another explanation could be KC restrikes with sliders being produced for veterans or collectors simply because after 1955, army berets were issued with slider pockets.

An original badge for me is either ordnance issued or an offer for private purchase to members of armed forces once approved by Regimental authority. KC badges with slider don’t fall in either of these.

[Luke H]

Originally Posted by tcrown

I would say that your badge was likely struck with an original die made by Gaunt. This doesn’t mean it was originally issued to parachute forces.

A few facts:
- QC Parachute Regiment badges were introduced in Aug 1955 struck on base metals and equipped with lugs;
- Maroon berets with a backing pocket for the badge started to be issued in 1955;
- The ordnance issue-type anodised or ‘staybrite’ badge was adopted in the early 60s. These badges were produced either with lugs or slider;
- The ‘staybrite’ badge was not popular amongst parachute forces which created particularly in the 60s a strong demand for QC old pattern metal base privately purchased.

Can we imagine a shortage of QC metal badge in the 60s that would have led to large restrike/conversion of KC badges? It seems to me unlikely.

Another explanation could be KC restrikes with sliders being produced for veterans or collectors simply because after 1955, army berets were issued with slider pockets.

An original badge for me is either ordnance issued or an offer for private purchase to members of armed forces once approved by Regimental authority. KC badges with slider don’t fall in either of these.

If you claim the KC Gaunt die has been restruck then woe betide every collector who has an example as it could be a restike on loops… indeed many of the slidered Gaunt badges bear scars from conversion from loops. Which would be a very odd thing for a faker to do.

That I am yet to see any KC Gaunt die badges with either Gaunt B’ham marked slider or the 15mm fake mark makes me believe they are not restrikes and have not been restruck from the original die.

The question for me would be what was being made and issued late 1940s - 1954?

And does a beret having a slider pocket from a certain date necessarily mean badges were not issued with sliders before then. Not necessarily in my view.

[tcrown]

From the time of their original introduction, cap badges for parachute forces (AAC or Parachute Regiment) were designed with lugs. This doesn’t mean that badges of other units attached to Airborne Forces didn’t have sliders (RAMC, RA to name a few)
We have evidence that paratroopers complained about the excessive loss of badges due to the slider type of fixture (‘the prong type fixing is insecure. The badge is easily lost when jumping with the beret rolled, and the necessary stitching on the beret is unsightly’ RHQ Para Sept 1960, source Lock p206).

I doubt that KC para badges with slider were adopted in large number by parachute forces in the 1950s simply because plenty of KC badges with lugs existed at the time and had been proven satisfactory for more than a decade. Also, the QC para badges were introduced first with lugs in 1955 which is another indication that sliders were not favored then by parachute forces.
With respect to berets, I have to correct my statement about the introduction of backing pocket for the badge. It seems that it could have been as early as 1953 even earlier. I misinterpreted O. Lock’s comments in his book ‘Airborne Headdress on p79. I also saw this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/304852049...b306%7Ciid%3A1

Unfortunately, we can’t draw any conclusion. We can’t exclude the possibility that KC para badges with sliders were worn in the 1950s.

[pioneercorps]

Originally Posted by Arnhem Jim

Hello Jim,
Several experts from the forum have provided extensive guidance on the regimental cap badge of the Parachute Regiment. Over time, and with their permission and encouragement, I've compiled an article incorporating their expertise on the subject. You may want to glance at the following;

http://arnhemjim.blogspot.com/2011/0...cap-badge.html


Best regards,
Arnhem Jim
Arizona Territory

Hello Arnhem Jim

I've tried taking a quality image photo of my Parachute Regiment, but I cant take one by using my phone camera, I'm trying to sort this out.

Would it be OK for me to add a photo to this thread, if/when I do have a better quality image.

Regards
Gerwyn

[Arnhem Jim]

Hello Gerwyn,
If you are talking about my blog page article, have no objections whatsoever. I believe you can attach it to the COMMENTS on the article, or send it to this thread.
Regards,
Arnhem Jim
Arizona Territory

[pioneercorps]

Originally Posted by Arnhem Jim

Hello Gerwyn,
If you are talking about my blog page article, have no objections whatsoever. I believe you can attach it to the COMMENTS on the article, or send it to this thread.
Regards,
Arnhem Jim
Arizona Territory

Hello Arnhem Jim
Thank you for replying.
I opened your link, which had good quality pictures of the Parachute Badge, showing the genuine ones, and what to look for in the fake ones, the slider on mine covers the centre.
I hope to get better quality photos sorted by Sunday.
I will post it in this thread
Regards
Gerwyn

[pioneercorps]

Originally Posted by Arnhem Jim

Hello Jim,
Several experts from the forum have provided extensive guidance on the regimental cap badge of the Parachute Regiment. Over time, and with their permission and encouragement, I've compiled an article incorporating their expertise on the subject. You may want to glance at the following;

http://arnhemjim.blogspot.com/2011/0...cap-badge.html


Best regards,
Arnhem Jim
Arizona Territory

Hello Arnhem Jim

Here are my Para badge photos.

PARA1.jpg

PARA3.jpg

PARA4.jpg

PARA5.jpg
Sorry about the the top two being upside down, in my pictures their facing down.
Regards
Gerwyn