8th Gurkha rifles Kilmarnock

[JerryBB]

Got this today and everything looks good, nicely maker marked and dated and broad arrow stamped 1940.

Regards,

Jerry

[ANGLE IRON]

Nice find, That badge is one of the most copied , unfortunatly mine is wrong and just a gap filler.

[JerryBB]

Originally Posted by ANGLE IRON

Nice find, That badge is one of the most copied , unfortunatly mine is wrong and just a gap filler.

I was glad to chance upon it in a local antiques shop. I had read that the pipers & drummers badge was frequently copied, but as it is in situ, I thought it was likely to be good.

Regards,


Jerry

[badgecollector]

awesome find Jerry
well done
bc

[gurkharifles]

I'd appreciate a photo of the rear of the badge - the hat is obviously genuine, but I've seen many Gurkha hats given a "spurious" badge to "complete" it.
This badge is the most copied Gurkha badge of all time!
If the badge has been there for 70 years - it should be fairly obvious - in terms of the imprint that is left on the Hat.
This could all be sour grapes on my part as I've never seen a genuine version of this badge - and if you've got one then I'm hugely jealous!

[Phillip Herring]

I admit to being ignorant of all things Gurkha, but I have a couple of questions.
Would the Gurkhas caps and uniforms have been made in India?
I usually associate Hobsons with officers' caps and uniforms. Did Hobsons manufacture caps/uniforms for the ranks?

Phil

[JerryBB]

Originally Posted by gurkharifles

I'd appreciate a photo of the rear of the badge - the hat is obviously genuine, but I've seen many Gurkha hats given a "spurious" badge to "complete" it.
This badge is the most copied Gurkha badge of all time!
If the badge has been there for 70 years - it should be fairly obvious - in terms of the imprint that is left on the Hat.
This could all be sour grapes on my part as I've never seen a genuine version of this badge - and if you've got one then I'm hugely jealous!

You could be right, I admit to buying this on impulse without doing any research in advance, but the price was so low that if only the hat is right I probably still got a good deal. I had not realised that originals of the badge were so scarce, or that it was one for pipers & drummers.

I have just taken these indoors so sorry if they are not great and I hope these extra pics allow you to answer your questions.

Regards,

Jerry

[peter monahan]

The Men-At-Arms book on the Gurkhas - hardly the last word in research but a good quick reference - says that Gurkha officers wore the Kilmarnock. That is to say, Subedars, Sub.-Majors and so on. Their kit was very likely, like the British officers' kit, made in the UK and not India, so the label needn't be a warning sign. About the badge, I don't know enough to have an opinion.

Peter

[JerryBB]

Originally Posted by peter monahan

The Men-At-Arms book on the Gurkhas - hardly the last word in research but a good quick reference - says that Gurkha officers wore the Kilmarnock. That is to say, Subedars, Sub.-Majors and so on. Their kit was very likely, like the British officers' kit, made in the UK and not India, so the label needn't be a warning sign. About the badge, I don't know enough to have an opinion.

Peter

Hi Peter and many thanks for posting the info.

I think that the cap is good and that seems to be most other peoples opinions where I have posted it.

Whether the badge is original, as I thought was the case, or is a copy that has been added since the war as Gurkharifles has suggested might be the case has yet to be decided and I await his opinion of the badges reverse and the imprint on the cap, because I also don't know enough on these to say, though the imprint looks pretty convincing to me.

Regards,

Jerry

[revdougal]

Laurie Archer, an early guru on restrikes 25 years ago, warned against this 8GR badge unvoided beneath the 8.

[JerryBB]

Originally Posted by revdougal

Laurie Archer, an early guru on restrikes 25 years ago, warned against this 8GR badge unvoided beneath the 8.

Thanks for this info, as it seems to clear up the question of the badge's originality.

Regards,

Jerry

[Gurkha]

Gents,
I would be careful with this. As has been said the '8'th pipers Kilmarnock badge is suspect. No need to restrike these as It is still the same and worn by the Regt now part of the Indian army. Re the Kilmarnock it is on, these regulary turn up wartime dated all made by Hobson.These were not only worn by Gurkha units but some african ones as well. These appear to tall to be Gurkha. Also the piping is wrong. The currant opinion is that these are for an african unit.
Regards
Steve

[JerryBB]

Originally Posted by Gurkha

Gents,
I would be careful with this. As has been said the '8'th pipers Kilmarnock badge is suspect. No need to restrike these as It is still the same and worn by the Regt now part of the Indian army. Re the Kilmarnock it is on, these regulary turn up wartime dated all made by Hobson.These were not only worn by Gurkha units but some african ones as well. These appear to tall to be Gurkha. Also the piping is wrong. The currant opinion is that these are for an african unit.
Regards
Steve

Thanks Steve for the low down on the Kilmarnock. Any idea on what African unit these were made for?

Regards,

Jerry

[Postwarden]

Whilst the cap is obvously real the presence of a broad arrow and a date means it is an official issue item destined for ORs and not officers who bought their own caps from the regimentally-designated hat maker. A British maker such as Hobsons making caps for Indian regiments would seem to be unusual as they must have been cheaper to make in India.

Whilst not any sort of expert on cap badges it does look a trifle new

Postwarden

[peter monahan]

Steve

Your post reads "The currant opinion is that these are for an african unit." Whose opinion, please?

I didn't bother to check the piping colour, as I assumed that would have been done, but I'd be surprised if this were African. The Royal West Africa Frontier Force - battalions in Nigeria, Ghana, Sierre Leone - wore a red fez style cap in full dress, as did the King's African Rifles, who were recruited in Kenya, Uganda, Nyasaland and British Somaliland. However, I don't claim any real expertise in the area, so am certainly willing to be informed further!

Respectfully,
Peter