British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

Recent Books by Forum Members

   

Go Back   British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum > British Military Insignia > Infantry (& Guards) Badges

 Other Pages: Galleries, Links etc.
Glossary  Books by Forum Members     Canadian Pre 1914    CEF    CEF Badge Inscriptions   Canadian post 1920     Canadian post 1953     British Cavalry Badges     Makers' Marks    Pipers' Badges  Canadian Cloth Titles  Books  SEARCH
 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31  
Old 15-09-09, 01:33 AM
John Mulcahy's Avatar
John Mulcahy John Mulcahy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,291
Default

You are welcome, a few other pieces for you re hackles and coloured bonnets.

Hackles/Plumes

A Grey plume was authorised for the ful dress "fur cap" by the war office on April 11 1903.

A Grey hackle was authorised for wear on the left side of the foreign service helmet in 1934. (It is quoted as being worn unoficially since 1919) contained in file WO 32/12059. However in Badge Backings and Special Embilshments of The British Army it is recoded that 2nd Battalion first adopted the hackle in the FSH while in Egypt in 1904 and the 1st Battalion were wearing it at Malta in 1909

The Grey hackle for pipers was authorised in 1937 (WO 32/12059) but appears to have been worn a few years prior to that judging by photographs.

On June 1 1946 the regiment formally asked for permission to wear the grey hackle in the beret. Photographic evidence shows it to have been worn in the GS cap prior to this.


With regard to the adoption of the blue caubeen in place of the khaki GS cap. Head dress is not my thing but WO32/12989 REGIMENTAL DRESS AND BADGES GENERAL (CODE43a) Introduction of coloured bonents for Irish Regiments dated 1948/49 in the National Archives might help.

John

Last edited by John Mulcahy; 15-09-09 at 02:16 AM. Reason: added commentry on the use of hackle in the FSH
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 07-12-09, 12:57 PM
saintconor's Avatar
saintconor saintconor is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 139
Default New Inniskilling Fusiliers - Opinions Please

Hi,

I have attached some pictures of the latest addition to my small (but growing) Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers collection. It has no makers mark but it has 5 holes in the rear which I gather is a positive sign. Do you think the badge is genuine? What years do you think it was worn? Assistance very much appreciated.

I have also included a copy of the regimental hackle which is another recent addition.

Thanks

Conor
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Skins Front.jpg (72.1 KB, 55 views)
File Type: jpg Skins Back.jpg (70.1 KB, 59 views)
File Type: jpg Hackle.jpg (64.6 KB, 36 views)
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 07-12-09, 06:41 PM
saintconor's Avatar
saintconor saintconor is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 139
Default Worth holding on to? Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers

I seen this on ebay a few months ago and managed to pick it up for about 3 quid. It was described as being an original WW1 badge but it is in awful condition. It has been polished so much you can hardly read the Inniskilling scroll. The flames have been broken of the grenade and are now held on with a bit of solder. The slider has also had a large portion cut off. On top of this it has no sweat holes and no makers mark. Is it genuine? If it is I think it will do as a gap filler for now. Advice very much appreciated.

Regards

Conor
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSCF0994.JPG (64.7 KB, 118 views)
File Type: jpg DSCF0995.JPG (62.3 KB, 106 views)
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 07-12-09, 08:10 PM
Sonofacqms's Avatar
Sonofacqms Sonofacqms is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 6,786
Default Inniskillings

Broken or clipped sliders are generally a sign of badges being taken off a belt, the fact there are no braze holes would not put me off this badge and the fact the flames are held on by lead solder, only make me think that it was on a belt and got damaged. I would keep it until a better one comes along.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 07-12-09, 09:37 PM
2747andy 2747andy is offline
Former Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Porthcawl, South Wales
Posts: 7,658
Default

Conor,
I agree with the above, however I would attribute the clipping of sliders, to the introduction of the beret, in that, when fitted, the end of the slider would often protrude below the headband and hence the reason they are found clipped or in some cases folded back on themselves! The other reason, again due to being worn in the beret, was that the beret use to come with a leather sleeve inside, into which the slider/shank was supposed to fit. Often the slider was too long and prevented the badge's slider fitting neatly and again resulted in the clipping!

Andy
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 08-12-09, 09:08 AM
Faugh-A-Ballagh's Avatar
Faugh-A-Ballagh Faugh-A-Ballagh is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: County Down, Northern Ireland
Posts: 723
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2747andy View Post
Conor,
I agree with the above, however I would attribute the clipping of sliders, to the introduction of the beret, in that, when fitted, the end of the slider would often protrude below the headband and hence the reason they are found clipped or in some cases folded back on themselves! The other reason, again due to being worn in the beret, was that the beret use to come with a leather sleeve inside, into which the slider/shank was supposed to fit. Often the slider was too long and prevented the badge's slider fitting neatly and again resulted in the clipping!

Andy
Hi Andy,
I'm pretty sure that this badge would never have been worn in a beret with the leather sleeve. Most likely a caubeen or an old style GS beret, which I believe didn't have one. I've never seen a caubeen with the sleeve for a slider.

Connor,
I look upon badges like this as having character. In my opinion, the original owner polished it regularly and had it repaired rather than replaced, so he must have been rather fond of it. It's ones like this that probably saw a bit of service. I would definitely keep and be proud of it.

Just my opinion

John
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 08-12-09, 10:19 AM
Alan O's Avatar
Alan O Alan O is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,730
Default

Could I point out that the design is 1906-26 therefore should not have been worn with a beret or a GS cap.

Alan
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 08-12-09, 11:01 AM
Faugh-A-Ballagh's Avatar
Faugh-A-Ballagh Faugh-A-Ballagh is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: County Down, Northern Ireland
Posts: 723
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan O View Post
Could I point out that the design is 1906-26 therefore should not have been worn with a beret or a GS cap.

Alan
I stand corrected!
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 23-01-10, 06:05 PM
Paddy's Avatar
Paddy Paddy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Portsmouth Area
Posts: 1,057
Default Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers 1926 - 34 White Metal Cap Badge

Hello

Has anyone got pictures of the front and back of a genuine Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers 1926-34 White Metal Cap Badge that I could see please. Also, does anyone know of any telling signs of a genuine or restrike badge.

Many thanks in advance.

Paddy
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 23-01-10, 06:51 PM
rockape560's Avatar
rockape560 rockape560 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: northern ireland
Posts: 1,211
Default

hi paddy,

dont have a pic but look at the website IRISH REGIMENTS of the BRITISH ARMY.theres a great pic of the front of the badge you are looking for as well as all the cap badges of the irish regiments.

hope this helps,

philip
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 23-01-10, 07:40 PM
Paddy's Avatar
Paddy Paddy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Portsmouth Area
Posts: 1,057
Default

Philip

Many thanks for the link although I think there are a few dubious looking badges on there (brass & WM Royal Ulster Rifles Airborne badges to name but a few). I have a version of the WM 1926-34 badge (pictures attached) but I do not believe it is genuine, if anyone can prove me wrong I wil happily listen. Although my badge has a nice strong slider I think the main body of the badge is too thin, too sharp edged and the points where the Inniskilling scroll joins the turrets are too narrow. Comments welcome

Many thanks again

Paddy
Attached Images
File Type: jpg The Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers (WM).jpg (80.3 KB, 76 views)
File Type: jpg The Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers (WM)(Rear).jpg (69.3 KB, 78 views)
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 23-01-10, 08:00 PM
wright241's Avatar
wright241 wright241 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In Luxembourg for the last 20 years and staying. They take much better care of us here....
Posts: 2,995
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy View Post
Philip

Many thanks for the link although I think there are a few dubious looking badges on there (brass & WM Royal Ulster Rifles Airborne badges to name but a few). I have a version of the WM 1926-34 badge (pictures attached) but I do not believe it is genuine, if anyone can prove me wrong I wil happily listen. Although my badge has a nice strong slider I think the main body of the badge is too thin, too sharp edged and the points where the Inniskilling scroll joins the turrets are too narrow. Comments welcome

Many thanks again

Paddy
I seem to recall that the crispness of the stamping at the back of the scroll was much better than this. This seems very smooth - or is it from a worn out die.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 24-01-10, 11:32 AM
QOSY's Avatar
QOSY QOSY is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 156
Default

I have this one, that is a very solid badge, and differs in that the bottom of the scroll is not cut away where it joins the castle...The downside is that it is maker marked A.J. Allen (B'ham) Ltd, and looks a little to dark on the back.
Jim
Attached Images
File Type: jpg P1020894.jpg (38.3 KB, 73 views)
File Type: jpg P1020895.jpg (34.9 KB, 86 views)
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 24-01-10, 08:06 PM
dubaiguy's Avatar
dubaiguy dubaiguy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Scotland
Posts: 967
Default

Paddy

Below is what I consider to be a genuine badge. Note area where scroll meets the castle. Hope this helps you.
Mark
Attached Images
File Type: jpg scan0007.jpg (54.5 KB, 86 views)
File Type: jpg scan0008.jpg (52.1 KB, 85 views)
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 27-01-10, 02:05 AM
John Mulcahy's Avatar
John Mulcahy John Mulcahy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,291
Default

A difficult badge to judge in my opinion.

Just like all single metal construction items one has to rely heavily on general indicators such as slider shape, general finish and patina as well as examining the known fakes.

I have no reliable indicators for this badge.

If you look at the obvious fakes sold by the likes of the British Badge company you notice they produce a sample in brass with the flag pole not connected to the upper scroll. Also to note that the scroll ends are joined to the turrets with a "butt joint" rather than a singe point.

http://www.britishbadge.co.uk/produc...oducts_id=1232

This "butt joint" is not an exclusive indicator of a fake as I have seen many samples that I consider good with it.


The example I have has the "point type" joint between the scroll and turret and unusually has a WM slider. My badge is very similiar to Paddy's - but has some extra wear to the title scroll. Having had a quick look at the images posted they appear to me at first analysis that they might be from the same die, with possibly some extra voiding done to the scroll attachment in mine and Paddys.

I believe it to be genuine - but have no proof positive.

comments welcome.

John
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_6834.jpg (96.0 KB, 53 views)
File Type: jpg 1926.jpg (37.2 KB, 52 views)

Last edited by John Mulcahy; 27-01-10 at 02:21 AM.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
inneskilling, inniskilling, inniskilling fusiliers

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

mhs link

All times are GMT. The time now is 04:48 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.