Heavy AAC badge ?

[marinus]

Good afternoon gents,

AAC badge number 25 fell on my doormat this afternoon after a long journey from the UK.

I think it' s a die-cast (?) badge with a non-voided crown that I haven't seen before.
The weight is 13.51 grams which is much more then the usual 7 or 8 grams of the normal die-struck badges.

May I have the benefit of the wisdom of this forum, please?
What are your opinions?

AAC-BADGE-25-1.jpg AAC-BADGE-25-2.jpg

Marinus

[Luc]

Probably one that was locally made from a die-struck badge.

I have seen similar badges so I would say it looks good, I would happily add it to my collection.

[Luke H]

I agree with Luc. It appears to be cast from an original. Who, what, when, where, why I shall leave to others. ‘Theatre made’ badges are their own niche minefield.

For what it’s worth it appears to have some age to it and the loops from what I can see do not scream modern repro to me.

[marinus]

Thank you very much again, Luc and Luke!

Marinus

[Artillery909]

Originally Posted by marinus

AAC badge number 25 fell on my doormat this afternoon after a long journey from the UK.

Send it back, it's a modern fake.

Who was the seller?.

[Luc]

Originally Posted by Artillery909

Send it back, it's a modern fake.

Would you care to elaborate on that?

[Artillery909]

Originally Posted by Luc

Would you care to elaborate on that?

Sure. I bought one myself and had it appraised by a guy who knows these badges well. I was shown screenshots of half a dozen that were exactly the same. Most were ebay offerings but there was also an image of one saved from the website of a well known Dutch dealer. I was told that these only started appearing on the market around seven years ago and the screenshots were collected over just an eighteen month period.

Wartime locally made badges to the army air corps are rare so the sheer number of the above appearing over such a short period of time, was all I needed to consign mine to the scrap heap.

Hope that helps.

[marinus]

Originally Posted by Artillery909

Send it back, it's a modern fake.

Who was the seller?.

Oh dear.

Bought this on eBay together with a nice tank regiment badge.

Can you share those screenshots with the forum please?

Marinus

[Artillery909]

Originally Posted by marinus

Can you share those screenshots with the forum please?

I wish that was possible but after receiving the information, there was no reason for me to save the photos.

As is so often the case, a badge is dividing opinion so if you'd prefer to take the advice of others, then that's absolutely fine. I'm as certain as it's possible to be that this is not a genuine piece and gain nothing from spreading misinformation.

Please can you pass on the user I.D of the ebay seller from who this came; you can do so by private message if you prefer.

[Frank Kelley]

The badge is perfectly original, I have much the same from it's original wearer, who gave it to me over forty years ago, they are simply die cast rather than die struck and I believe that they are early made examples rather than theatre made.

Originally Posted by marinus

Oh dear.

Bought this on eBay together with a nice tank regiment badge.

Can you share those screenshots with the forum please?

Marinus

[Artillery909]

Originally Posted by Frank Kelley

The badge is perfectly original, I have much the same from it's original wearer, who gave it to me over forty years ago

I'll have to take you at your word on that Frank. If you're happy that a veteran obtained badge is always cast iron proof of originality, then fair play to you; others have made the same mistake.

Half a dozen very rare airborne badges appearing in relatively quick succession was a major red flag for me.

Are there not other locally made badges out there to the army air corps and assuming yes, how often do those turn up?.

I have rug rats to attend to.

[Luke H]

Originally Posted by Artillery909

Half a dozen very rare airborne badges appearing in relatively quick succession was a major red flag for me.

As per my reserved comments and general cynicism with all lost wax / silicone mold copy badges, they are all too easy to produce nowadays and some repros from Pakistan etc. have been around for years now.

Thus, bar a few documented exceptions, then without provenance as per Frank’s example for me there’s nearly always a question mark.

However I would say that items appearing in quick succession does not equal fake. Very often in this hobby scarcer pieces are like buses.

[Artillery909]

Originally Posted by Luke H

As per my reserved comments and general cynicism with all lost wax / silicone mold copy badges, they are all too easy to produce nowadays and some repros from Pakistan etc. have been around for years now.

Precisely Luke, and let's not forget that with the boom in the value of airborne and special forces insignia in recent years, the temptation to make hard to detect fakes has never been greater. Anyone can make such badges at home without expensive tooling.

Originally Posted by Luke H

Thus, bar a few documented exceptions, then without provenance as per Frank’s example for me there’s nearly always a question mark.

Provenance is a funny old thing. Unless a veteran obtained piece is without question original, or can be seen to be one and the same in a period photo, then it must be accepted with a pinch (or shovel load) of salt. Unless of course someone else's say so also qualifies as provenance these days; each to their own there I think.

Originally Posted by Luke H

However I would say that items appearing in quick succession does not equal fake. Very often in this hobby scarcer pieces are like buses.

That's very true. In my experience though, 99% of such items applies to UK made insignia; one example might be the glut of plastic parachute regiment badges that passed through bosley's hands not that long ago. A dusty box of badges being found at the back of a storeroom shelf; now that I can understand, but six locally-made airborne badges?.

I was happy with the information that I was given. It came via a friend of someone whose record keeping of airborne and special forces fakes is impeccable.

[Luke H]

Originally Posted by Artillery909

A dusty box of badges being found at the back of a storeroom shelf; now that I can understand, but six locally-made airborne badges?.

I was happy with the information that I was given. It came via a friend of someone whose record keeping of airborne and special forces fakes is impeccable.

The AAC is not a rare badge despite being Airborne. On any given day on eBay you can buy a real one (or 8 in total listed tonight). However I appreciate a genuine theatre made AAC would be scarcer, but… stranger things have happened.

I had not seen a genuine Sharpshooters IY for sale for well over a year, perhaps two. Then in 2020 within the space of 6 months I saw 5 come onto the market, 3 appearing within a fortnight! No more have surfaced since and it is now over a year on.

May I ask since those six how many have you seen since and how long has it been?

Re your man was this their opinion based on six appearing in short order or did they evidence a single seller or spurious source as being responsible?

A few eBayers I know of involved in the sale of cast copies are ‘5555destination’ (or whatever his latest alias is), ‘peterg5733’, ‘pe1ju2’ and ‘int.militaria’. It should be noted the last three do state their wares are not original in the descriptions. I’m yet to see an AAC amongst their offerings.

[RobD]

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