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  #1  
Old 20-09-22, 07:25 PM
RichardP RichardP is offline
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Default Bronze Officer KOSB Badge

Any ideas on this recent find? A bronze KOSB officer badge. It’s not fretted, O/R pattern, standard size, east west blades and no makers mark.
Is it genuine or a fake and did KOSB ever bronze OSD badges as standard in WW1/2.
I would include a couple of photos but unsure how to download from a l phone.
Thanks for any assistance.
Richard
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  #2  
Old 01-10-22, 04:12 PM
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Alan O Alan O is offline
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Richard

I am unaware of any bronze version simply because the KOSB wore silver badges in their bonnets. The only variation was I believe the Adjutant who wore a peaked cap with a reduced size badge.

Alan
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  #3  
Old 02-10-22, 06:53 AM
Alex Rice Alex Rice is offline
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I was speaking to a friend recently who said bronze badges were allowed but privately purchased and no a requirement, so not all officers had them. They should be fretted though.
Cheers,
Alex
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  #4  
Old 02-10-22, 09:10 AM
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I am sure Alan is right, worn by the Adjutant and I am pretty sure discussed on here before but some time ago.
P.
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  #5  
Old 06-10-22, 10:08 PM
RichardP RichardP is offline
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Thanks gents, l did have my doubts as it does look unissued with no wear and tear on it. I’ll put it down to experience and bin it.
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  #6  
Old 07-10-22, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardP View Post
Thanks gents, l did have my doubts as it does look unissued with no wear and tear on it. I’ll put it down to experience and bin it.
I wouldn't bin it, I'd try and get some photos on the forum, it'd better to actually see the badge.
Do you know how to put photos on an email?
I could PM you my email and I could post the pictures for you.
I visited the KOSB museum in Berwick -Upon-Tweed some time ago, and as Alan says, there was a smaller bronze version on the peaked cap.
Don't bin it though, just yet.
Chris Walker
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  #7  
Old 08-10-22, 05:38 PM
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DO NOT BIN IT!

I have a Kings Own Scottish Border’s given to me 1990,s along with a Manchester Pals badge, these came with approximately 80 Bronze Officer’s badges I was allowed to look over collected by the wife’s husbands grandfather in his capacity as a Medical assistant WW1.

I was honest in at the time the badge’s worth and I did ask if I could buy them, but a Dealer had already first dibs, I was however gifted these two badges, Forum confirms the Manchester Pals, but didn’t confirm the KOSB for the reason it was never made in Bronze, it’s just too well made and the Provence! got me to think it’s wrong, so like me put safely to one side and wait till better info comes along, I’ll dig out a picture for you, all the best billy
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  #8  
Old 14-10-22, 02:27 PM
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Borderer Borderer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billy View Post
DO NOT BIN IT!

I have a Kings Own Scottish Border’s given to me 1990,s along with a Manchester Pals badge, these came with approximately 80 Bronze Officer’s badges I was allowed to look over collected by the wife’s husbands grandfather in his capacity as a Medical assistant WW1.

I was honest in at the time the badge’s worth and I did ask if I could buy them, but a Dealer had already first dibs, I was however gifted these two badges, Forum confirms the Manchester Pals, but didn’t confirm the KOSB for the reason it was never made in Bronze, it’s just too well made and the Provence! got me to think it’s wrong, so like me put safely to one side and wait till better info comes along, I’ll dig out a picture for you, all the best billy
The King's Own Scottish Borderers Have never had a BRONZE badge of any sort all badges authorised are Silver hallmarked, Silver plated most hallmarked and White Metal, there are BRASS cap badges worn on the foreign service Helmet. See my book:- Badges and Insignia of The King's Own Scottish Borderers Also Associated Volunteer and Militia Units from 1689 until 2006 From the Regimental Museum Collection and others' this book was reviewed in The Bulletin of the Military Historical Society last month. There may have been a sweetheart badge made in bronze but it would not be of regulation size. Further more the Forage Cap worn for a short period by the Adjutant and the Military Band Master was a reduced size silver cap badge which in later years would be worn on the undress Pipers sporran, also WO sword belt Chapter 4 badge 20 in my book. Further more there were officers and WO cap badges made in Silver with part of the badge in Gilt and the cross of St Andrew and the Castle of Edinburgh remaining in silver, this was a barracks badge worn on the Kilmarnock peaked diced forage cap.
Cheers
Hiram

I would BIN IT
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  #9  
Old 14-10-22, 04:10 PM
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Rob Miller Rob Miller is offline
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Colin Churchill shows Bronze OSD collar badges worn from 1902, it would seem like an odd mix if there wasn't a cap badge for Officers to purchase to match them, but I'm sure stranger things have happened.

Rob
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  #10  
Old 14-10-22, 04:15 PM
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Rob Miller Rob Miller is offline
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And of course there were bronze badges with blades made to be attached to leather picture frames.

I find it strange that anyone would suggest "binning" a badge because in their opinion it wasn't worn on a hat?

Rob
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  #11  
Old 15-10-22, 11:18 AM
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Default KOSB Bronze Officer’s Cap Badge

Hi all found the badge.

You can see remains of Bronze Wash to front and rear of badge, front looks good the Jewels, Lion, Lettering, and the pebbly grit, all look good- a lovely badge, the rear you can see the Bronze Wash and is darker (not a fan of rear) lugs being half round flats to inner face, the loops you see this better with the flat to inner face of loop!

O/K I know the provenance being the 1st Gulf War I was detached to RAF Odium making Chaff Dispensers for Chinook and Puma (Anti Aircraft misfile safety flare dispenser’s) after 12 days on we had a day off, the pub I was having a drink in, the Landlady brought a bag of her Husband’s - Grandfather’s down from upstairs within a picture of him wearing Red Cross Armband and containing 80+ Bronze Officer’s badges, this and a Manchester Pals being gifted too me, so not bought from an Antique shop, a stall nor car boot sale, this was always with allOriginal WW1 Officer’s Bronze badges.

Now I know these are not meant to be! have been told it’s not real because they where never made this way! Fine! why then does this badge exist in a bag of badges not seen the light of day since WW1 and found in the back of a wardrobe?

I am happy with it because I seen what was with it! would a private purchase explain it? Is there something about the badge that screams it is bad? Look forward to hearing your views, all the best Billy
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 87AFB340-FE7A-468B-8F37-503BC2E4EAF8.jpg (71.3 KB, 54 views)
File Type: jpg 3F50D3DC-CA04-48DA-9964-C3357EB21E51.jpg (71.4 KB, 42 views)
File Type: jpg 2A09A95B-958A-422D-B04F-C6737A088DEF.jpg (56.1 KB, 29 views)

Last edited by billy; 15-10-22 at 11:59 AM.
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  #12  
Old 15-10-22, 11:30 AM
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Alan O Alan O is offline
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Are you sure that is actually bronze and not a corroded nickel one. The staining and colouration , the die stamping and the lugs all suggest that it is not an officers badge.

Alan
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  #13  
Old 15-10-22, 11:55 AM
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Hi Alan it is definitely Bronze, happy to post to you so you might handle it? In hand looks and feel good, I mean can you see anything wrong with it other than it is Bronze? If in White metal would you think it a copy or restrike?

But because it is in Bronze - it’s wrong! unfortunately I’m Biased as I seen what it came out off and what it was with! I have no other explanation as to why it is this material nor Colouring, perhaps if I where to put alongside other Bronze Officer’s badges this would help?

It’s an Enigma for now and will keep it safe, once binned I would regret if someone came up with a reason for these types of badges? Hopefully #1 post will send in picture’s of his?

Thanks for looking Alan would be nice if other’s had similar? I also have a Bronze Argyll and Sutherland unvoided, now this could be a copy or Commonwealth again a well made badge, and cannot recall where I obtained it from?

All the best Billy

Last edited by billy; 15-10-22 at 12:01 PM.
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  #14  
Old 15-10-22, 12:09 PM
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Luke H Luke H is offline
 
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Simple answer is it’s a very obvious Marsh catalogue fake.
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  #15  
Old 15-10-22, 01:36 PM
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Being a fake badge aside, it happens time after time that corroded or oddly patinated badges are presented here on the forum mistakenly for bronze or something else. I can understand this if a collector is not familiar with proper bronzed badges, but there are some rather obvious clues.
Die struck or stamped OR pattern badges that appear this way should always be viewed with suspicion. Genuine bronzed badges will not show corrosion in the manner of the subject badge either.

CB
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