Maori Poineer patch

[atillathenunns]

Tinto, thanks for sharing your NZNC badges.
I think if everybody on this forum posted their "NZNC" badges, we would start to see a clear pattern of what is scarce and what is common when it comes to these badges.

Hopefully Wayne Ihaka will post his collection of NZNC badges in the next couple of days

The following pictures are of my one and only NZNC badge. Originally it had a pin back attachment, and as can be seen, it now sports a nice pair of lugs, which have been sweated on using silver rod, which in time the weld will turn black and none will be the wiser that it was originally a pin back. (The lugs were replaced before I got it)

[Wayne Ihaka]

here are some badges

the small round collars and small NZNC badge as shown first are all Watts marked (front & back shown)

there is a second Watts marked badge

the second set of small round collars are probable copies

[Wayne Ihaka]

the NZNC shoulder above is also marked Watts - different to the others I have

the last 4 photos are the front and rear of my 3 NZNC badges with the round crown

[atillathenunns]

Wayne, thanks for posting your NZNC badges, the last 3 NZNC badges are a treat to see, especially the photo of the reverse of these lovely badges.

Unfortunately I am a complete novice when it comes to the Watt made badges, and although I have seen a few being offered for sale over the years, the fact that very good copies exist has always put me off.

Reuben Watts interestingly enough was a well known Wellington artist and writer, and a musician of skill, especially on the banjo. By profession Reuben was a precious metals craftsman who moved to Auckland in 1909, setting up shop at No. 41 & 42 Security Buildings in Queen Street.

All information I have found on Reuben Watts suggests that he was a highly skilled craftsman and he held a "Special Appointment to His Excellency Lord Islington."

Why on earth did he make such shabby NZNC reinforcement badges, or didn't he?

[Tinto]

Thanks for showing your NZNC badges, Wayne, a great collection.
Cheers, Tinto

[woronora]

Last year I visited a small museum in Anafarta, Gallipoli which contained a number of war relics collected around the Suvla and Anzac areas. On display they had a fewof NZ badges which had been found in the ANZAC area over the years. There was a Maori Company badge included in the display, which had been found at No 2 outpost. I now wish I had both taken a photo of it and noted the size of the crown as it may have helped the discussion on these badges.

For anyone visiting Gallipoli, I can highly recommend a visit to this little museum at Anafarta as it has some very interesting items and is a good place to sop for lunch.

Cheers

John

[pukman]

Wayne,I have to agree with the other chaps and say that is a interesting and dedictated collection of Maori battalion badges.Well done and thanks for sharing your treasures.

cheers Iain

[atillathenunns]

Originally Posted by woronora

Last year I visited a small museum in Anafarta, Gallipoli which contained a number of war relics collected around the Suvla and Anzac areas. On display they had a fewof NZ badges which had been found in the ANZAC area over the years. There was a Maori Company badge included in the display, which had been found at No 2 outpost. I now wish I had both taken a photo of it and noted the size of the crown as it may have helped the discussion on these badges.

For anyone visiting Gallipoli, I can highly recommend a visit to this little museum at Anafarta as it has some very interesting items and is a good place to sop for lunch.

Cheers

John

I have heard many good things about Ozay Gundogan and his War Museum, I used to work as a tour guide many years ago and have done a number of tours to Gallipoli, unfortunately Ozay's museum wasn't open then, but the Kabatepe War Museum which I believe is now closed, had only just opened.

The following are some close up photos of the front and backs of Tinto's Watt made badges from post #30

[saumua]

Originally Posted by atillathenunns

Another interesting person that Wayne introduced me to at the badge meeting in December 2010, allowed me to take a copy of the following photograph of his father "Sergeant Poutawera Leonard Rahiri" Service No. 60610, who embarked with the Maori Contingent's 30th Reinforcements on the 13th June 1918.




Sergeant Rahiri is photographed wearing the distinctive Maori Contingent's 'reinforcement' badges that were made in Auckland by Watts Ltd.

Dave Corbetts book (The NZ badge bible - The Regimental Badges of New Zealand) unfortunately states that these so called "First pattern badge was worn by A Company only."

Sadly Dave was very wrong and the Watts made badges are in fact unofficial reinforcement badges that were only worn in New Zealand and on the transport ships.

The good news is that Sergeant Rahiri's son still has his dads red and black Maori Contingent patch, unfortunately I haven't got a photo of it, but hopefully Wayne might be able to sort that for us.

Fantastic Photo never seen the collars worn before.... I need to pull finger on my article.

Shaun

[Wayne Ihaka]

my theory on these small round collars is that the real ones have the watts stamp and/or at the least the tuft of feathers on the taiaha at botton right

the copies of which I have a pair displayed do not have the tuft

I may be wrong but that seems to be the pattern - of course there will be many with round collars that do not have the tufts who swear they are real.

Nice pair Tinto - like them

[atillathenunns]

Originally Posted by Wayne Ihaka

my theory on these small round collars is that the real ones have the watts stamp and/or at the least the tuft of feathers on the taiaha at botton right

the copies of which I have a pair displayed do not have the tuft

I may be wrong but that seems to be the pattern - of course there will be many with round collars that do not have the tufts who swear they are real.

Nice pair Tinto - like them

Yep, I too think Tintos NZNC collar badges are the ideal benchmark examples of what originals should look like, especially when it comes to the lugs and maker marks.

The following is a nice Watts made badge that was offered on Trademe that I was out bid on.



The following well known NZ Gallipoli photograph was taken by James Read in 1915, it shows the 1st Maori Contingent at No 1 Outpost.



The following close up shows the chap on the left is wearing a NZNC badge, none of the others in the picture seem to be wearing cap or collar badges, it is also interesting to note that none are wearing the red and black blaze on their service dress caps.

[atillathenunns]

The following photos show officers wearing NZNC badges on their helmets and service dress caps.
No NZNC collar badges appear to worn in the group photos.



Back row—
Chaplain Major [Chaplain Class III (Major)] Henare Wepiha Te Wainohu, Sevice No. 16/545, 1st Maori Contingent, Headquarters Staff
Lieutenant Simon James Stewart Coupar, Service No. 16/260, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
Chaplain Major [Chaplain Class III (Major)] Hector Alfred Hawkins, Service No. 16/1021, 2nd Maori Contingent, C Company
Centre row—
Captain Pirimi Pererika Tahiwi, Service No. 16/304, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
LieutenantTuru Hiroti, Service No. 16/392, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
Lieutenant Thomas Matengaro Hetet, Service No. 16/445, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
Second Lieutenant Autini Pitara Kaipara, Service No. 16/10, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Lieutenant James Paumea Ferris, Service No. 16/50, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Lieutenant William Houkamau Stainton, Service No. 16/90, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Major Albert Edward Mills Jones, Service No. 16/3538, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Front row—
Lieutenant Roger Ingram Dansey, Service No. 16/317, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
Captain Frederick Burton Mabin, Service No. 16/544, 1st Maori Contingent, Headquarters Staff
Lieutenant Colonel William Oliver Ennis, Service No. 16/582, 1st Maori Contingent Headquarters Staff
Lieutenant Henry Peacock, Service No. 16/575, 1st Maori Contingent, Headquarters Staff
Lieutenant Lionel George Ashton, Service No. 16/1026, 2nd Maori Contingent
Lieutenant Colonel Peter Rangihiroa Buck, Service No. 16/593, 1st Maori Contingent, Headquarters Staff
Lieutenant William Tutepuaki Pitt, Service No. 16/499, 1st Maori Contingent B Company



Back row—
Lieutenant William Houkamau Stainton, Service No. 16/90, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Lieutenant Thomas Matengaro Hetet, Service No. 16/445, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
Captain John Charles Tamanuiarangi Tikao, Service No. 16/227, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
LieutenantWilliam Huatahi Walker, Service No. 16/187, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
LieutenantTuru Hiroti, Service No. 16/392, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
Second Lieutenant Autini Pitara Kaipara, Service No. 16/10, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Lieutenant Simon James Stewart Coupar, Service No. 16/260, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
Front row—
Lieutenant James Paumea Ferris, Service No. 16/50, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Chaplain Major [Chaplain Class III (Major)] Henare Wepiha Te Wainohu, Service No. 16/545, 1st Maori Contingent, Headquarters Staff
Lieutenant Colonel Peter Rangihiroa Buck, Service No. 16/593, 1st Maori Contingent, Headquarters Staff
Lieutenant Colonel William Oliver Ennis, Service No. 16/582, 1st Maori Contingent Headquarters Staff
(Possibly) Lieutenant Colonel Alfred Henry Herbert, Service No. 11/1079, 3rd Reinforcements, Wellington Mounted Rifles
Lieutenant William Tutepuaki Pitt, Service No. 16/499, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Lieutenant Roger Ingram Dansey, Service No. 16/317, 1st Maori Contingent A Company
Major Albert Edward Mills Jones, Service No. 16/3538, 1st Maori Contingent B Company
Captain Pirimi Pererika Tahiwi, Service No. 16/304, 1st Maori Contingent A Company



Lieutenant Simon James Stewart Coupar, Service No. 16/260, 1st Maori Contingent A Company, Killed in action Somme, France 29th June 1916.



Second Lieutenant Autini Pitara Kaipara, Service No. 16/10, 1st Maori Contingent B Company, Killed in action Ypres, Belgium 4th August 1917.

[atillathenunns]

Originally Posted by saumua

Fantastic Photo never seen the collars worn before.... I need to pull finger on my article.

Shaun

Shaun, I look forward to your article, especially the photo of the original badge design submitted by the Hon. Dr. Pomare, and the rough sketch of the modified and final design by Wellington Jeweller G. T. White.

Evening Post, 6 October 1914, Page 10.




The following is another well know photo showing 1st Maori Contingent men waving their khaki helmets, and going by the previous document, it appears Chas. Hill and Sons, Hat and Capmakers of Lambton-quay Wellington manufactured the helmets.

[atillathenunns]

In regards to the newspaper clipping and the Defence Store’s document in my last post, I think it is worth mentioning that Major General Alfred William Robin was NZ Quartermaster-General from December 1910, to the 5th May 1919, he was also Commandant of the NZ Military Forces from 10th September 1914, to the 10th December 1919.

What's interesting to us NZ badge enthusiasts, is that Major General Robin was also the man most responsible for the Fern Leaf being adopted as New Zealand's national badge when he was Commanding Officer of the 1st Contingent to South Africa during the Boer war of 1899-1902.

The Assistant Quartermaster-General and Director of Equipment and Stores in Wellington was Major J. O'Sullivan.
Major O'Sullivan was appointed to the position of Defense Storekeeper in charge of the Wellington Defense Store’s Department after the death of the previous Defense Storekeeper Captain Sam Anderson had died on the 7th December 1899.

Major O'Sullivan is important as he was the man that was truly responsible for organizing the clothing and equipment of the Maori Contingent, and as the Maori Contingent was a newly formed unit with no parent unit in the NZ National Force, Major O'Sullivan was also responsible for tendering out the contract for supplying the Maori Contingent with badges.

Major General Robin as Commandant of the NZ Military Forces, would have been responsible for approving the Maori Contingent badge.

The real story of the Maori Contingent badge however cannot be told without the G. T. White document and badge sketches that are held at archives, and as Shaun has put his hand up to write an article, I am sure the rest of the forum members won't mind waiting a little bit longer.

The following NZNC badge is a rare gilt version (Same as the 3 bronze versions that Wayne posted)

[atillathenunns]

While I wait for the flood of forum members to post their 'NZNC' badges, I thought I will continue on with posting some more cool photos.

The following parade photo is from the Auckland Weekly News, page 36, 29th October 1914.
It shows 1st Contingent men parading in civilian clothing, so is likely to have been taken between the 21st October 1914, when the men began arriving at Avondale, to the 23rd October 1914, when they recieved their first issue of military clothing.



The following parade photo is from the Auckland Weekly News, page 39, 5th November 1914.
It is likely this photo was taken either on the 23rd October 1914, when Colonel A. W. Robin inspected the Contingent, or most likely it was taken on the 24th October 1914, when the Hon. James Allen, Minister for Defence inspected the Contingent.

As mentioned, the morning of the 23rd October 1914 was when the Contingent received its first issue of military clothing, this consisted of khaki working suits and dungarees similar to those issued to the Field Engineering Companies, and a slouch hat.



The following parade photo is from the Auckland Weekly News, page 36,10th December 1914.
The Governor inspected the Contingent on the 2nd December 1914, which gives us an exact date for this photo.
Although it is difficult to see as I have shrunk the phot down in size, the men are still wearing their khaki working suits. The reason for this is that the Contigent had received a supply of SD uniforms, but not sufficient numbers to cloth all of the 500 men in camp, so they were not served out until there was enough for the whole Contingent.



The following photo is from the Auckland Weekly News, page 50, 24th December 1914.
As can be seen, the Contingent have been issued their khaki drill uniforms, but don't seem to have been issued their khaki shorts yet. The photo also shows that no badges are being worn.