tartans

[muskey]

For my next theme I was thinking of starting to collect highland regiment cap badges. I know that each regiment uses different types tartans. My question is when I go to mount them in a display, is there one type of tartan i could use, or should I mount each cap badges with their own tartan? And where could I find out which tartan is used for what regiment?

[Roy]

Hi Muskey,

I'm afraid I can't help with answering your question but knowing how proud the Scotts are as a nation I'm sure there must be a different tartan for each unit.

Nevertheless I think it's a grand idea and wish you luck with your endeavor. Keep us posted how you get on and I hope you put an album together.

All the best, Roy.

[Empire collector]

These links might help....

A list of the Tartans

http://web.archive.org/web/200712181...n/tartansx.htm

And a list of Scottish regiments around the world. Just click on each one then scroll down to Uniform.
It will give you the tartan not only for the rank & file but for piper's kilts, plaids, bagpipe ribbons etc.
And for those regiments & corps that don't wear Scottish dress as a norm but have pipe & drums, their tartans too.

http://web.archive.org/web/200712130...ts/rgtscot.htm

Used to buy mine as a backing for frames from the numerous tartan stores in Princes Street in Edinburgh. That's if they are still there. I could get a yard of Government & other tartan cloth quite easily. But the online stores may not be quite as keen to sell such small amounts.

Hope this helps.

Alan

[David Tremain]

I seem to recall John Gaylor saying in his book that he preferred to use the Government Tartan as some of the others were too 'busy', if used as a backing for a display case.

David

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally Posted by muskey

For my next theme I was thinking of starting to collect highland regiment cap badges. I know that each regiment uses different types tartans. My question is when I go to mount them in a display, is there one type of tartan i could use, or should I mount each cap badges with their own tartan? And where could I find out which tartan is used for what regiment?

What you do is up to you as there is no "correct" way to display badges. Having said that, Highland regiments do wear their badges differently. On the glengarry the badge is usually backed with a black silk rosette.



On the balmoral or tam o'shanter (many regiments wore both) the badge was backed by a swatch of regimental tartan. Note also that detail mavens will tell you that not only must the tartan be the correct one, but the way in which it is cut matters.

Tartan was usually obtained from condemned kilts, so the material was of wide, coarse weave. The best way to obtain this material is to find "original" swatches that were worn contemporarily with the badges. The kilt has changed over the years, just as everything else has. Modern kilt makers use lighter wool of different weave so finding scrap material is difficult, and finding it of the right weight and size to match the backing 'pattern' in use by Highland regiments more challenging. For example, my unit (The Calgary Highlanders) "correctly" backs the badge with a swatch cut only from Government tartan where the double green lines meet. The cap badge should fill up the entire space where the double green lines form four solid green squares.

I won't pretend this has always happened, and particularly under field conditions, I am sure quartermasters in the past may have had different rules or even ignored those rules they had. But other units have similar guidelines outlining which part of the tartan pattern is "acceptable" for backing the badge, in the same fashion as the coloured tartan "flashes" worn by British Highland units.





There are other options to pursue, such as using cloth cut in the regimental colours (i.e. those used in the regimental tie, where this is also not a tartan tie), or you could use the facing colours, for two examples.



Or as mentioned above, find a single, appropriate background colour that nicely complements the badges - Government tartan, khaki, OD green or the like.



The Government Tartan.

I don't know of any single printed source that outlines regimental customs with regards to backing flashes. I had attempted to capture some of that info on my website but it was poorly sourced and I am not sure I ever bothered to replace it on the site lacking the proper documentation.

Check out this image from the QOCH of Can site for other examples:



Note the Cameron of Erracht tartan swatches are all cut at a specific point in the pattern. (E16 is, I believe, Hunting Stewart, and is also cut on a specific part of the pattern - though for some units, it is difficult to say with precision what the "correct" pattern of these swatches were, and indeed, there may be multiple correct patterns, or no correct pattern. I'm not sure all the possible combinations have been documented.)

[muskey]

Thanks guys for all your input. as I said I am just toying with the idea of collecting the highland regiment cap badges next, because I do have a few right now that I was going to mount with some infantry badges that I 'm mounting now, but I didn't think they looked right, with the regular infantry badges. As for the tartan I was just wondering if I should be looking for the different regimental tartans as I get the cap badges or not. And thanks Michael, I very grateful for all that great info.

[tynesideirish]

Government Tartan, can't really go wrong with that. a good collection of Highland badges takes some beating for visual effect though I hope you are going to specialize within a specific time frame. Otherwise there are thousands of badges to get and most, less the most recent or most common, go for huge amounts.
Also if getting into this sphere you could do worse than tracking down copies of the journal Dispatch. The journal of the now sadly defunct Scottish Military History Society.

[muskey]

I have been doing a little bit of research on the different Scottish regiments of Canada and did happen to find a small list of the different units and the tartans that they use.

The Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders of Canada (Princess Louise's)
Tartan: Black Watch
Raised: 1903

The Black Watch (Royal Highland Regiment) of Canada
Tartan: Black Watch
Raised: 1862

The Calgary Highlanders
Tartan: Black Watch
Raised: 1928

The Cameron Highlanders of Ottawa
Tartan: Cameron of Erracht
Raised: 1885

The Queen's Own Cameron Highlanders of Canada
Tartan: Cameron of Erracht
Raised: 1910

The Canadian Scottish
Tartan: Hunting Stewart
Raised: 1915

The Essex & Kent Scottish
Tartan: Macgregor
Raised: 1886

The 48th Highlanders of Canada
Tartan: Davidson
Raised: 1891

The Highland Fusiliers of Canada
Tartan: Mackenzie
Raised: 1891

The Lake Superior Scottish
Tartan: Macgillivray
Raised: 1910

The Lanark & Renfrew Scottish
Tartan: Black Watch
Raised: 1866

The Lorne Scottish (Peel, Dufferin & Halton) Regiment
Tartan: Campbell of Argyll
Raised: 1866

The New Brunswick Scottish
Tartan: Leslie (dress)
Raised: 1871 (in 1954 mermerged with the Royal New Brunswick Regiment [Carlton & York])

The Nova Scotia Highlanders (North)
Tartan: Macdonald
Raised: 1871

The Nova Scotia (Cape Breton) Highlanders
Tartan: Black Watch
Raised: 1881 (absorbed the Cape Breton Highlanders in 1954)

The Perth Regiment
Tartan: Douglas
Raised: 1868

The Pictou Highlanders
1954 merged with the Nova Scotia Highlanders (North)

The Seaforth Highlanders of Canada
Tartan: Mackenzie
Raised: 1912

The Stormont, Dundas & Glengarry Highlanders
Tartan: Macdonell of Glengarry
Raised: 1868

The Toronto Scottish
Tartan: London Scottish
Raised: 1915

so I am going to assume that these are the most common, if there are any that is not listed let me know. as I am medically retired from work (disabled) I am on a fixed income so I think I will stay to this list if I decide to collect the Highland Regiments.

[JamesAA]

I recently went through my own decision cycle on this same subject. I focus my collection on Canadian cap badges (standard O/R variants only) WW II to present. As I get a critical mass of a logical grouping, I intend to mount these groups in frames. The badges of the Highland units with their relatively larger size and Scottish design elements would make a excellent display, especially when framed with a nice tartan backing.

I initially thought of backing each badge with the tartan of the unit. I came up with this list of highland units (WW II to present only) and tartans, using the following two references (a couple of additions to your list):

The Uniforms and History of the Scottish Regiments, Major R.M. Barnes, 1956;

DUCIMUS, The Regiments of the Canadian Infantry, 1992.

48th Highlanders of Canada,Davidson
Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders of Cda, Black Watch
Argyll Light Infantry (Tank), Black Watch
Black Watch of Canada, Black Watch
Calgary Highlanders, Black Watch
Cameron Highlanders of Ottawa, Cameron of Erracht
Canadian Scottish Regiment, Hunting Stuart
Cape Breton Highlanders, Black Watch
Essex and Kent Scottish, MacGregor
Essex Scottish, MacGregor
Royal Highland Fusiliers of Canada, MacKenzie
Highland Light Infantry of Canada, MacKenzie
Lake Superior Scottish, MacGillivray
Lanark and Renfrew Scottish Regiment, Black Watch
Lorne Scots, Campbell of Argyll
New Brunswick Scottish Regiment, Leslie (Dress)
North Nova Scotia Highlanders, Murray of Atholl
Nova Scotia Highlanders, MacDonald
Perth Regiment, Douglas
Pictou Highlanders, MacKenzie
Prince Edward Island Highlanders, Black Watch
Queen's Own Cameron Highlanders of Cda, Cameron of Erracht
Scots Fusiliers of Canada, Black Watch
Seaforth Highlanders of Canada, MacKenzie
Stormont, Dundas and Glengarry Highlanders, MacDonell of Glengarry
Toronto Scottish Regiment, Hodden Grey

Note that there have been many amalgamations and de-amalgamations over the years. Check the following DHH web-site for the proper lineages: http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhh-.../index-eng.asp

It is a challenge to find a source of small pieces of tartan at little or no cost. Buying tartan from typical suppliers is not a practical option. The minimum order is one meter of cloth, of which you would only use one small piece. At $80 or more per yard of wool material, your bits of tartan, in the majority of cases, would far exceed the cost of the badge. In addition, I think it would be difficult to mount the badges with all these different tartans in a pleasing manner. This led to a decision to mount my badges with a single tartan backing.

My short list includes the following tartans:

Government/Black Watch - Long tradition as a universal military tartan and dark colour would contrast well with the predominately white metal badges.

Royal Stuart - Tartan of Queen Elizabeth II and historical linkage to the Kings and Queens of Scotland.

Maple Leaf - Official tartan of Canada and used by Canadian Forces pipe bands with no highland regimental affiliation, e.g. The RCR Pipes and Drums.

I am leaning heavily towards the Maple Leaf tartan.

Cheers,
Jim

[Hussar100]

Originally Posted by tynesideirish

Government Tartan, can't really go wrong with that. a good collection of Highland badges takes some beating for visual effect though I hope you are going to specialize within a specific time frame. Otherwise there are thousands of badges to get and most, less the most recent or most common, go for huge amounts.
Also if getting into this sphere you could do worse than tracking down copies of the journal Dispatch. The journal of the now sadly defunct Scottish Military History Society.

Speaking as an ex-serviceman I think a lot of the advice you've been given sounds very good. I'd certainly advise you keep the individual regimental tartans as backing for the respective badges.

Speaking as a member of an Irish regiment I'd say they pay less heed to the use of tartan and always wear saffron on parade. That does mean however you'd have a lot of saffron backed badges in your collection and you may not want that. That being the case it would maybe be a more interesting collecting feature to use the Irish Regimental Tartans (where they exist) to make your display more interesting and unique to you.

My late father in law (RIP - sadly missed) was Royal Scots and he made this little plaque which he was manifestly proud of (sorry about the image quality, I scanned it to save time). We still display it on our wall as a constant reminder of him. You can see he felt it was ok to use the swatch in the diagonal, probably with the St Andrew's Cross in mind. Again, arguably, that's a nice way to make your own collection more "you". The more rigid collectors wouldn't agree but I think each collector wants to leave his own signature on a display and therefore anything he/she does to make it more individual would be acceptable.

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally Posted by muskey

I have been doing a little bit of research on the different Scottish regiments of Canada and did happen to find a small list of the different units and the tartans that they use.

The Calgary Highlanders
Tartan: Black Watch
Raised: 1928

Out of curiosity, I'm wondering where you found this date? I don't want to make a big deal out of it since it won't matter much for your purposes, but for your info, it is wrong. Perhaps it is a typo. The regimental history is a bit convoluted which may add to the confusion. The 103rd Regiment (Calgary Rifles) were raised on 1 April 1910, then as part of the Otter Committee reorg in 1920 became The Calgary Regiment. The 1st Battalion of The Calgary Regiment was designated a highland unit in 1921. In 1924 the 1st Battalion was split off to become a separate regiment, The Calgary Highlanders.

The DHH fact sheet is here, with the primary references:

http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhh-...ar2/ch-eng.asp

Sorry to be pedantic, particularly if you already knew all this, but if not, thought it might be of interest.

Good luck with your project, and be sure to share photos with us!

[muskey]

Michael
I don't know how reliable that the info is that I posted about those regiments. I did a google search on the interwebby thing and found a site were it was posted. I am sorry that it was incorrect, thanks for pointing that out

[REMEVMBEA1]

If you decide to include corps you'll find that most TA/TAVR corps units also wore a tartan badge backing , in my case attached to 32 (Scottish) Signal Regt (V) we wore a Grant Red patch.

[jf42]

Tartan backing was only used on the khaki 'Tam o' Shanter' bonnet, dating from the First World War and not consistently within regiments or down the years. Black Watch or 'Government' tartan would be a sober and safe compromise as a backing, not least because most of the regiments, apart from the QO Cameron Highlanders, used it as a base for their setts when these were designed in the late C18th.

Ironically, perhaps, the Black Watch were the only regiment not to use tartan backing for the cap badge. Increasingly from 1919 they wore the regimental badge only on the Glengarry bonnet- without a rosette- while tending to wear only the red hackle on the ToS- definitively so from World War Two.

Remember that the glengarry bonnet was the dress headgear for all Scottish infantry regiments from 1914 until the end of WW2 (apart from Pipes and Drums and the bands) so dark blue, black, and dark green if appropriate, would also be fine as a backing.