"Smasher hats"

[Sonofacqms]

I have a couple of KOYLI "Smasher hat" badges, one with two loops and one with a long slider.

As the term "Smasher hat" is referred to in K&K Vol 1, I am unsure as to what type of headgear this refers to. I have looked on the KOYLI image website to no avail as there does not seem to be any photos with this large badge in situ.

Would any KOYLI experts have any pics of this headgear or could explain what it looks like.

Thanks in advance

Rob

[Jeff Mc William]

Hi Rob
Yes, I am a bit mystified by this description too. Is it the same as a "cheese-cutter" ? of which I also don't know to what it refers ??

[AndyC_65]

Rob,

I've always wondered this myself, and always assumed it to be an Australian style slouch hat.

I have searched for a reference, and never found one. I have however found this reference to another badge:-

"The flash was worn on both sides of the Wolseley helmet and on the upturned left brim of the smasher hat."

I've looked at the KOYLI museum before and never found one. I am overdue a visit, so will check when the curator is there and pop along.

Cheers,

Andy C

[KLR]

I've never understood where the ghastly term "Smasher Hat" came from but I believe it is what was officially called the Service Dress Hat and / or the Universal Headdress and more popularly known as the Slouch Hat or Bush Hat. I thought I had some WO notes about it somewhere but can't find them.
Andy C, I'd be very interested to know where you got your reference regarding the Wolsely and the Smasher.
All I can state at present is that it was first worn in South Africa 1899-1902 and at home until 1905 by the regulars but was still worn thereafter by the Volunteer and even the Territorial battalions. It was reintroduced during the 1st World War on the Salonika front in 1915 and in great numbers for the far eastern theatre of the 2nd World War. Today the hat survives only with the Gurkhas.

Numerous badge Pattern details refer to use on the 'cap', 'FSH' and 'Universal'

[Sonofacqms]

Many thanks for your answers chaps, I can remember Laurie Archer mentioning this type of headdress in his lists and I thought it could be a slouch hat of some sort.

Quite why only KOYLI refer their headgear as "Smasher hats" is beyond me, if the Museum cannot help, where do we go?

Rob

[JerryBB]

Originally Posted by AndyC_65

Rob,

I've always wondered this myself, and always assumed it to be an Australian style slouch hat.

I have searched for a reference, and never found one. I have however found this reference to another badge:-

"The flash was worn on both sides of the Wolseley helmet and on the upturned left brim of the smasher hat."

I've looked at the KOYLI museum before and never found one. I am overdue a visit, so will check when the curator is there and pop along.

Cheers,

Andy C

Does make it seem that the Slouch hat is the answer. Must try to remember this for future reference.

[AndyC_65]

Originally Posted by KLR

Andy C, I'd be very interested to know where you got your reference regarding the Wolsely and the Smasher.

With reference to the SA Q Services corps.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q_Servi..._(South_Africa)

Cheers,

Andy C

[Deejayuu]

Originally Posted by Sonofacqms

I have a couple of KOYLI "Smasher hat" badges, one with two loops and one with a long slider.

As the term "Smasher hat" is referred to in K&K Vol 1, I am unsure as to what type of headgear this refers to. I have looked on the KOYLI image website to no avail as there does not seem to be any photos with this large badge in situ.

Would any KOYLI experts have any pics of this headgear or could explain what it looks like.

Thanks in advance

Rob

Hi Rob,
took some time but I have found a reference in the 1900 Dress Regulations. There is a badge is described as a Pugaree Badge, the field cap badge being half the size. The size and style are correct so could this be the headdress it was used on or could there be another headdress that also wore the oversized badge? The smasher hat may be an unofficial term used by the KOYLI but I have also heard it associated with the East Yorks regt. I have an East Yorks example, I will try and post an image tomorrow.
Cheers, Dave

[John Mulcahy]

Although the attached makes no reference to "The Smasher" it does reference the petition by the KOYLI to move to a large size badge for the NP Forage Cap (i.e. Brodrick) and the FS Helmet which was also to have a slider. This may be pertinent to the discussion.


It is from the RACD list of changes (WO359 vol 12 page 255)

Note also the reference to the FSH that preceded the Wolsey as "The Indian Pattern"

John

[REMEVMBEA1]

Originally Posted by Jeff Mc William

Hi Rob
Yes, I am a bit mystified by this description too. Is it the same as a "cheese-cutter" ? of which I also don't know to what it refers ??

I may be wrong here but wasn't the NX slouch hat sometimes referred to as a potato masher and could this be a corruption of that term?

[Postwarden]

An interesting thread.

I agree that what is referred to as a smasher is what we now call the slouch hat.

In his book Dress of the Royal Artillery D Alastair Campbell refers to the Hat, Felt introduced with khaki service dress in 1902. He quotes Army Order 40 of 1902. He has a picture of what we would now call the slouch hat and notes that " a similar headress the Slouch Hat is now worn in the topics".

There are several entries on the hat in the Army Clothing Department Records held at Kew. My notes don't start until 1901 but an entry from
14/3/07 reads - Obsolete – Hat felt, khaki, Special South African

Interestingly there are two other entries relating to the dress of Volunteer Battalions which refer to it as the slouch hat;
26/9/01 - 4 VB RWK – CinC approves undress uniform – drab serge jacket with turn down collar and horn buttons – the crown on these to be corrected [sic]. Drab tartan trousers with red welt. 11/03/02 Noted that white metal badge [no design noted] deposited Extra note dated 2/1/02 Slouch hat approved and sample deposited

17/6/03 - CinC approves for 1 VB RF – trousers, tartan, drab, puttees
Jackets. Drab, serge - Hat, Slouch with badge added 22/4/04

Lastly the term Smasher. This rang bells as dated slang and a quick internet search revealed several references to Smasher meaning
Anything very large or extraordinary; a whopper which I think is a good description of the hat. So maybe that's how it got its name?

The attached scans show the hat worn (in various styles) by a TA Bn - a T title is just visible - and the hat as worn in Salonika in WWI identified from the Salonika photograper's name on the reverse. The third show 1st VB in their smashers/slouch hats.

Jon

[Graham Stewart]

MountedInfantrymanTheGreenHowards.jpg
The head-dress in question as worn by a member of the Yorkshire Regiment Mounted Infantry.

With thanks to "Soldiers of the Queen".

[Hussar100]

Smasher Hat is definitely a slouch hat. See here: http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/fo...howtopic=72900

The Great War Forum is always a great source for info on the period.

[GriffMJ]

I have this headdress described as the "Sombrero" by Rogers & Co.

[Hussar100]

Originally Posted by GriffMJ

I have this headdress described as the "Sombrero" by Rogers & Co.

Apparently in Spanish, the word sombrero means any hat with a brim. Perhaps to a hat maker the term is a bit like "Hoover" for a vacumn cleaner?