Wearing of Home Service Helmets by Civilians

[peter4447]

Recently purchased this lovely old (sepia) photo on EBay of what I thought was a Victorian/Edwardian Volunteer Band. Now that it has arrived I am not so sure!
The Bandmaster (seated) wears a Lyre as a Cap Badge and although very difficult to make out, it appears the centre of the Helmet Plates (which are QVC) consists of just the number '5'. The collar dogs appears to be a plain King Edward crown.
The Bass Drum carries the Royal Coat of Arms but any wording higher up is not readable. The side drum also carries 3 scrolls and the only word that can be read (on the lowest scroll) appears to be 'TOWN'.
The belts have a snake buckle and Austrian knots appear on all jackets.
I am wondering if any member has come across this situation before please when looking at old Victorian/Edwardian photos, that shows what appears to be a civilian town band wearing what is full military dress of the period.
Many thanks
Peter

[daverpol]

Possibly a Police band?

[CftD]

Peter - The practice of civilian brass or silver bands adopting military style was very common in the 19th and early 20th centuries. The law always required modification of insignia as the wearing of it by non military persons was a criminal offence. Even though the helmets look 'military' the plates would probably have centres stating just who they were. The Austrian knot on the tunics was a common feature in civilian bands and many ebay offerings today listed as Royal Engineers are in fact civilian. What a superb photograph ! Regards. David

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by peter4447

Recently purchased this lovely old (sepia) photo on EBay of what I thought was a Victorian/Edwardian Volunteer Band. Now that it has arrived I am not so sure!
The Bandmaster (seated) wears a Lyre as a Cap Badge and although very difficult to make out, it appears the centre of the Helmet Plates (which are QVC) consists of just the number '5'. The collar dogs appears to be a plain King Edward crown.
The Bass Drum carries the Royal Coat of Arms but any wording higher up is not readable. The side drum also carries 3 scrolls and the only word that can be read (on the lowest scroll) appears to be 'TOWN'.
The belts have a snake buckle and Austrian knots appear on all jackets.
I am wondering if any member has come across this situation before please when looking at old Victorian/Edwardian photos, that shows what appears to be a civilian town band wearing what is full military dress of the period.
Many thanks
Peter

Peter, they seem to me to be quite likely a Volunteer Force (VF) Band formed in a local town/village. Prior to 1862 there were independent VF companies (of varying strength and various 'styles' of uniform) based upon villages and towns. After that date these disparate units were brought together in Administrative 'battalions' and efforts were made to gradually standardise their uniforms. This latter process was accelerated after 1872 and the Childers Reforms of 1881 consolidated matters when the Administrative units became "volunteer battalions" of Regular Line Regiments, although it took decades to be complete. One feature of all these "volunteer" units was the Austrian Knot on the cuffs. Helmets were purchased with funds raised via local appeals and the subscriptions of the men themselves. Although these men are technically civilians (just as Territorials are today) they paid a fee for the privilege (as they saw it) of belonging to a part time (volunteer) unit of the British Army's "Reserve and Auxilliary Forces". It is not impossible that the drums would have had the name of the town on them, especially if they were 'presented' by the towns people, which was a common way of getting the necessary instruments. Brass instruments, especially trumpets and bugles, were often similarly inscribed.

The men in your photo are wearing frocks (cheaper, loose fitting and with 5 buttons and minimal lace) rather than tunics, and the helmet is of the early pattern, all of which fits with a typical Volunteer Force unit of the late 1870s.

Studying the uniforms and insignia of the VF units alone is a highly complex hobby as badges changed frequently and often had a local flavour to them. They were very much a force of the middle classes (whereas the Militia was more working class) and as such their own money was used to supplement government grants to buy uniforms and insignia, which led to a great deal of variation. It was even possible to be an associate (honorary) member by paying a regular subscription, which entitled you to wear the uniform without necessarily attending drills and training camps. As you might imagine this led to a great deal of ridicule from the general public, but this was just one way of raising funds to maintain the overall wellbeing of the unit.

[Graham Stewart]

Would have to agree with Toby, that the likely hood of a civvy band being dressed like this was highly uncommon. However what you did get was civvy bands being enlisted into the Volunteers enmasse to enhance the units reputation. Check this link out for a vast array of band photos both military and civil.;-
http://www.ibew.org.uk/vbbp-uk.htm

[Graham Stewart]

phot10740.jpg

From the same site - have a familiar look?

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by Graham Stewart

Attachment 45026

From the same site - have a familiar look?

A great picture, and this time wearing tunics rather than frocks. The trombonist far left has a great array of VF proficiency stars too!

[peter4447]

Thank you all Gentlemen very much indeed for your helpful replies. With the Royal coat of arms emblazoned on the bass drum, I do feel that this is indeed a Volunteer unit Band. I would really like to actually pin down the ID of this Band so it looks very much like I shall have to keep on digging!

Thanks for the info Graham about IBEW which I am familar with several of the photos on the site are from my from collection.

Next job is to have the piccy reframed to join the others that I have.

Thanks again everybody
Best regards
Peter